June 3, 2008
A Librarian in the Closet
On ACRLog, Stephanie Willen Brown has come out of the closet to report that she has spent a semester in the closet. The University of Connecticut librarian says she was holding office hours.
Ms. Brown says she wondered what would happen if a librarian held office hours outside of the library. Would she be more visible? So she got a converted janitor’s closet in an academic building near the library, hung a sign with her name on the door, and spent one hour a week there. During that time, she says, she saw eight people. But “unofficially, the stats are much higher: I ran into people in the hallway, bathroom, and going in & out of the building,” she reports. And she was able to hand out reference advice.
It was a success, she says, if one considers the “PR value” of being seen in the building on a regular basis. Next semester, if she holds office hours again, she expects more business, closeted with students and faculty. And she wonders: do other librarians hold office hours? —Josh Fischman
Posted on Tuesday June 3, 2008 | Permalink |Comments
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Law librarians at Arizona State answered reference questions from their offices when I was there about five years ago.
Fortunately the administration appreciated that enabling patrons to sit and speak with librarians in a semi-private and semi-comfortable environment better served the clientèle, even though it probably lessened the quantity of reference questions answered.
— Scott Jun 4, 12:24 AM #
Here at Slippery Rock University the business librarian Cate Rudowsky pioneered this concept several years ago successfully. We are all looking for ways to make our library and information service more immediate and relevant to our clients.
— Philip J Tramdack Jun 4, 07:37 AM #
i am a liaison to our College of Health & Human Performance [recently changed to College of Nursing, Health and Human Services] — for the last 2 fall semesters, i have held ‘office’ hours in the HHP Dean’s Conference Room — available for reference, instruction consulting/scheduling, collection development — they’ve got a new Dean coming in; i hope he’ll be willing to continue this relationship
— Marsha Miller @ Indiana State University Jun 4, 08:47 AM #
My branch library is located in an academic building, but I still don’t get very many reference questions. I don’t think it’s a question of location as much as attitude. Either library patrons feel that they don’t need help, or they’re afraid (embarrassed) to ask for it.
— Linda Jun 4, 09:23 AM #
I am in a small satellite library in the College of Engineering. I answer reference questions in my office, in the halls or walking between buildings. The “engineering campus” here is located in a corner of campus across a 4-lane road so it feels isolated and many students and faculty won’t go to the main campus library so having me among them makes the library more accessible.
— John Jun 4, 09:39 AM #
I’ve considered spending regularly scheduled time in one of our campus’ larger computer labs but haven’t tried it yet.
— Sara Jun 4, 10:06 AM #
Hamline University in Minnesota has reference librarians that are there during normal business hours and they are always used.
— Eliot Jun 4, 10:06 AM #
The job market for academic libraris is terrible at the moment. To dwell upon such illogical and trivial matters is folly. I am now an M.D. after spending years wasting valuable time earning an MLS and a Ph.D. in history. Neither of which ever amounted to anything due to the curse that is “affirmative action.”
Yet I have now been a practicin psychiarist for two years and make, before taxes, $178,567 per year. For any students reading this, I taught history at the college level for 4 years, worked as an academic librarian for 3 and the job market is so dismal….please, do not allow your “advisors to brainwash you Do NOT enter library science or higher education teaching unless you ether are independently wealthy or have anothe degree to “fall back on.”
I so enjoy being an M.D. But, the Chronicle is biased and does not reflect the true job market. There will neysayers to me..but, I hope as I told my former students that still Email me for advice… DO NOT go into library“science” or 1) it is not a true science and since I have an MLS no one an fault me for not knowing what the field is like.
Do something better with you life. In hghe education, and no one wil admit it but it is true, if you don’t agree with the liberal/socialist propoganda being regurgitated towoard students today,then you will never gain tenure nor fit in. I have many years experience as both a Professor of History and a professional Academic librarian. Don’t be fooled by the silly topics brought forth in the Chronicle. I resigned and went to medical school,took out a lot of loans to do so….and I can honestly say since I was a Full time Professor of history and an academic libraian…choose a field that will feed your family and you can always have a second major It makes a lot of professors angry that they spend 30 years to make jus $90,000 per year when I did the same job they did and in my first year as an MD made $165,764..and received a $20,000 bonus.
Live life and do not be fooled by the silly cocept that the job market in library science is good.It is not. No unless you are a minority. I now look back at the librarians and professors I used to work with and now that I am a MD, I look down upon them. They are not real “Doctors.” An M.D. is a doctor. A Ph.D. is…well, either unemloyed or working part time.
I have an MSLS and the entire degree is joke.
It is so pathetic. MY advice to young people: Forget academe…it’s will only cause you frustration unless you are a “minoriy.”
I had the courage to overcome this and each paycheck I receive I laugh at the knaves that stay in acadee because that is all they are able to do. But, can say that in addition to being a M.D. ( a REAL “Doctor”) I also have a Ph.D in history and an MS in library science. Bottom line: You can do bette than a mere librarian or a fake “doctor” with a Ph.D that thinks they deserve the title of “DR” when the have never completed medical school.
The best decision I EVER made was to leave academe forever. And, every time I receive my pay via direct deposi, I look back and see how truly naive and brainwashed the “doctors” of philosophy are.
Be Socratic: Question everything they say….the Ph.D’s are not true “doctors.” They are not MD’s.
A pitiful group.
— Tim Harris Jun 4, 10:22 AM #
OK, Tim, thanks for repeating your viewpoint over and over again. I wonder if the minorities who you clearly feel took the jobs that were owed to you got hired instead because they could make a point without repeating themselves and sounding angry and vaguely unbalanced?
More importantly, how are people supposed to earn the M.D.s that you value so highly if there are not academic librarians to help them?
— O.C. Jun 4, 10:32 AM #
Oh, and excuse my spelling errors….I’m holdig my 11 month old son while typing with one hand.
— Tim Harris Jun 4, 10:33 AM #
I am stating a fact regarding the job market for professonal librarans today, at this moment in history.
Do not play a red herring and change the topic to simply me being “angry” at the system that is so obviously strained.
I taught for years. I stood in front of a classroom and was the advisor to many students. Don’t claim that I don’t know what other academics go through. I say what I say because it is the truth. Many advisors do not tell graduate students the truth regarding the job market in academe. It is, for those in the humaities or library science, totally abysmall.
And for those working in those fields know this to be true. I chose to rise above the liberal/socialist agenda that professional historians so often try to brainwash their stuents with.
That is another topic. What is important is that there exists little opportunity in either Library Science or being a professor in a humanities field.
Yes, I needed librarians in medical school…yet, since I alread had an MLS I did not need the very often.
I defiedt the odds and went to medical school when I was 37. I’ve never regretted it.
The question is NOT how did librarians help me…but what are the recent graduates going to do when they finally hit “real life” and have to make a living with a degree (i.e. MLS or Ph.D) that will just cause them to have to wait for years for a full time job?
No. Do somethng with your life. If you want an MLS, then by all means ge it. However, get another degree as I did that will secure your financial future and release yourself from the arrogance and half-truths of “advisors.”I know, sir, because I lived it. I was a Professor and a librarian and I can say that students, who often look upon their professors as role models, to not be brainwashed and be encouragd to consider careers outside of academe.
Yes, I needed a librarian now and then but what I did is not the issue….I am saying that we should never, never tell undegraduates that fields like Library Science are a “good choice.”I did and I have done in two years (post-fellowship) what you or no other professor can say: I make two or three times the salay thati it took you decades to get and it was not that difficult.
It is not. You are, if you say this, setting your students up for disaster and profoud disappointment when they must face the real world.
I chose a different path and I only hope that the students reading ths will explore opportunities beyond their dreams of being some famous Ph.D or librarianWhen you are older and have children, you will be much happier with the salary of a true “Doctor” (MD not a Ph.D) or another professional field outside of academe.
It’s your future….do not waste it on an MLS or dreams of being some famous Professor. Be practical, think it through, and if, after th you still want to pursue jobs in higher education…then best of luckBut, remember, the very people that write positive responses are usually already have good job an come to you with a different perspective.
I was not fooled. I am now a successful MD and make more in a month than some make in a year.Be as Socrates…question everything your advisor says. Do not believe every word they say for you wll regret it someday.
Me….angry? No..Just pragmatic an exposing the truth because, as I’ve said, I’ve been in your shoes and being in academe is NOT going to get you, future graduates, a job.
Live and go beyond what you think you can. You’ll not regret it and you will love your bank account when you’ve earned more in one year while it took your liberal/socialist professos 30 years to mak half that.
And if any professor wants to compare salaries with a real doctor, an M.D…..I’m happy to….I have done what you could not…and in just two years after my post-resideny fellowship.— Tim Harris Jun 4, 11:21 AM #
I find it significant that you assumed I am a “sir”.
— O.C. Jun 4, 11:23 AM #
Me…“unbalanced?” Well, sir, come to my office as a patient and I would surmise that you could very easily fit into at least for categories of the DSC IV.
— Tim Harris Jun 4, 11:24 AM #
So, back to the article…
I tried weekly office hours last semester in the campus coffee shop. My experience was similar to Stephanie’s, but I only advertised my presence to the departments for which I am the liaison. Most of the people I saw didn’t know about the office hours, but stopped by because they were reminded they had a question they meant to ask me, or to ask if librarians were in other extra-library locations. A few of my colleagues also do this in public areas of classroom buildings with more success. I’m going to try it again in the fall with wider advertisement. Not a big investment in time or effort, and the faculty I talked with really liked it.
— Maxine Schmidt Jun 4, 11:27 AM #
I apologize for the spelling errors….but you know what mean: Sir or Madaam.
I don’t personally care whether you are male, female or think you’re both.
I’m talking of the job market. And if you have such low self-esteem as to care whether I begin my message by using the word “sir,” then you have your own issues to deal with while hiding behing the little nest of the ivory tower.
I truly doubt you could function outside of academe. Most can’t. It is a truism that those that do…well, succeed…and those who don’t worry about whether they’re mistakenly called “sir” or madaam.” You will never be called “Dr” by a real MD..so, choose: Are you a sir or madaam? You are NOT a “Doctor.”
And, your pride is hurt from not being called a “doctor.” But,if you are one….what medical school did you graduate from…sir or madaam? Whatever you are.
— Tim Harris Jun 4, 11:33 AM #
Dr. Harris seems to have really major issues with Ph.D.s being called “Dr” by themselves or others, even though that is the traditional title for those with terminal, tertiary, or whatever-you-call-them degrees. I assume, charitably, that his training in history did not include the medieval history of the university.
And yet why would he even care? His central thesis appears to be [ok, I stopped reading after a while, but I think it was] “hey, I make so much more money than you chumps with my MD so I am better than you fools who stay in academia.” Isn’t his wealth and public status enough ego gratification? Oh well. I guess this is why some of us still try to teach the liberal arts, and further evidence that we fail much of the time…
— Nicholas Jun 4, 11:50 AM #
OK, so I’m gonna try to keep to the topic of the article…
I tried advertising ‘office hours’ ahead of time in an academic building and got no traffic at all. But, interestingly, when I just showed up and sent an email telling them where I was when I got there, they came in droves.
BTW, I’m a technologist and not a librarian, but I think the concept is the same.
— Carly Jun 4, 12:52 PM #
Tim Harris! You buffoon. Medical doctors actually took the title from academic doctors way back in the 18th century. Up until then, so-called medical doctors were known as “physicians,” and usually did barbering or potions and chemistry on the side. However, there was no title applied to those trades, as physicians were considered to be merely tradesmen (which, like dentists and lawyers, they really are), whereas doctors of philosophy were considered researchers, thinkers, and teachers, and could hold that esteemed title before their names. Physicians, being the jealous lot that they still are, resented this and unilaterally appropriated the word “doctor” for themselves even though the vast majority of them do not do research or teach. Lawyers did the same thing in the 1980’s; previously holding the degree of LLB, they began taking the degree of JD, so they TOO could be considered doctors. One suspects that plumbers will be next. So, physicians and attorneys and all the rest of your poseurs and johnny-come-latelys, move aside for the original and still the only true doctors, those who hold an academic doctorate.
— original marci Jun 4, 01:42 PM #
Tim Harris-
After a cursory consultation of DSM-IV-TR, you don’t seem to have any documented mental disorder. You are simply deeply bitter and resentful towards your academic advisers in particular and the academic community in general.
To initiate steps towards a resolution of your anger, I suggest that you send copies of your 2007 taxes to those academic advisers who so gravely misled you. This will prove your superior financial worth to those individuals directly responsible for your lack of wealth and professional respect for so many years.
$100.00 (your bill for my diagnosis—a bargain compared to your learned services :)
— Starr Jun 4, 02:07 PM #
I worked for a decade as a reference librarian in a University.
I had over the years several offices, in various parts of the library.
One office was built for the librarians within feet of the reference desk and was rarely visited by anyone, the las office I had was right by the front door of the library and because of this visual exposure there was a lot more interaction with patrons.
Many patrons assume that the reference staff spend their full time at the desk, and many students needs include more than can be accomplished at the ref desk so a librarian needs to have office time for more in depth assistance to patrons.
Dr. Harris, I am happy that you have finally found a profession that you enjoy. And I understand the frustration with academia and being a librarian, I found that where librarians are concerned administrators like to have it both ways,
They want librarians to publish, be on committees (as non voting members) and to act like other academics, but they do not treat librarians like faculty they treat them like support staff.
For example one time early in my career my institution had a budget crises, I was told at the end of the spring semester that as faculty were not getting raises (but staff were) that my salary was frozen, however then I (cheekily) asked as I was faculty did I get the summer off, I was told that for that purpose I was considered staff, but that as I was faculty that I was not entitled to overtime.
I was of course not faculty (I could not attend faculty meetings for example) but I did not want to be faculty. I enjoyed working with the students as a librarian, I think a librarian has a different role than a professor, because we do not grade the students were are not looked on as having a judgmental facet to our relationships and this puts us in a better position to mentor students, and as the interactions we engage in with students are mostly initiated by the student we do not have to deal with as much of the glazed over eye look that is prevalent in many classrooms of today.
Tim; for many of us life does not unfold as planned, I know at least ten doctors of medicine who went to law school because they were unhappy with the state of medicine, HMO BS, insurance premiums that were eating them alive et cet.
I went from being a lawyer to working in a law library because sometimes life is not all about the money.
— Marty Jun 4, 02:41 PM #
Thanks to all those who have shared their mostly successful experiences mirroring this article.
As for Dr Tim – I feel a great deal of sympathy for your family & patients having to deal with such an angry, egotistic human.
To digress a bit :) I grew up in a family where my father told us every day how he HATED his job. I grew up with one overriding concern – that whatever field I went into, it would be something that I enjoyed doing. Of course, some days are better than others <LOL> If a person enjoys Library Science or History (& I’ve known good individuals in both fields who enjoyed their work), then the satisfaction of doing one’s best and being happy in a choosen field is far more important than making $$$ ! It’s my hope that Tim (oops, Dr Tim) will come to understand this truth one day.
— Gary Jun 4, 02:51 PM #
I don’t think that 3 years is significant library experience. And just as Marcy said, sometimes it’s not all about the money, but the satisfaction you get from the interactions you have with students. You can always find a way to get by financially if you have a fulfilling job.
On topic—I’ve also tried having office hours in our cybercafe. It has led to some interesting library instruction sessions on online databases.
— Deedee Jun 4, 02:56 PM #
What a wonderful idea to hold office hours outside of the library! Fortunately, our librarians—in a community college—are kept hopping by the students who utilize extensively utilize their services. I have seen counselors use this satellite concept as well and think it’s great for departments who seem “fixed” to move outside of their comfort zones and meet the students where they are at at least once or twice during the quarter/semester.
Dr. Harris, librarians are expected to spell and write at an academic level equal to and above English instructors, as well as objectively provide information to all students in an open-minded, non-judgemental, and fair fashion. I daresay that these factors may have played a role in your not making a positive splash as a librarian. It is true; obtaining an MLS degree is becoming increasingly competitive, but there are jobs out there. One does, however, have to present themselves as an advocate/mentor for all students and illustrate that significant homework has been done in regards to the mission of the college or university.
In addition, let’s not be fooled. Many physicians are running for the exits due to increasingly high malpractice insurance premiums and lawsuits. Yeah. That big salary sounds appealing, but the hours stink and the premiums and the paperwork drain many a physician.
Last but not least, the last time I checked, there is a significant dearth of “affirmative action” minorities (other than white women who also are included under the umbrella of affirmative action), to be found in academic libraries. So, please don’t lay your own bitterness at the all-too-convenient altar of “you have to spout the liberal manifesto, sing Kumbayah, and dance the affirmative action two-step.” It’s too easy a target and too trite.
— Chased Away by Malpractice Premiums Jun 4, 03:08 PM #
Nothin’ like a Tim Harris to make us all feel good about ourselves. No matter how annoyed we are at our own life choices, our careers, our shortcomings — at least we’re not that guy. SW
— swishnets Jun 4, 03:21 PM #
Haha! I am always the killjoy for pointing it out, but this guy is pulling your legs! He probably is currently working in an academic library, doing something boring like sorting through dead politicians papers, trying to get some kicks by having people on.
— Julie Jun 4, 05:37 PM #
Two different comments here.
1. One of the librarians on my staff now works four hours a week in the college of nursing, the area she supports. The results have been extremely positive and they make heavy use of her time in “their” building. We hope to duplicate this model.
2. When I went to Library School at Emory University, some 30 years ago, my instructors were very clear about our futures in this career. Among their thoughts was to not go into Librarianship if one wants to make a lot of money. Yes, there are times when I am frustrated with the lower salaries, but I enjoy my work and I have no regrets about my choice of careers.
— Scott Jun 4, 07:56 PM #
One would wonder why Dr. Tim is reading articles in the Chronicle of Higher Education if he so gladly left academia.
— Alyssa Jun 4, 08:14 PM #
I enjoyed reading the rebuttals to my posts. My argument is this: The job market in librar science and/or tenure track positions in te humanities is so dismal, why encourage graduate students to pursue a dead end? Those that have responded are already employed in their chosen field. But, I say it is a disgrace to students to encourage them to go into Ph.D programs such as history that will get them no where. I have sat on hiring committees many times while a professor and saw the arrogance in the other committee members’ eyes. They have too often forgotten what it was to be a recent graduate.
Bottom line: The job market in library science is very abysmal. Why encourage and often stretch the truth to go into a field that is not only low paying but terrible when it comes to getting full time position.
My wife is a phyician, also. A pulmonologit specifically I know all about the histor of the title of “Dr” when it comes to Ph.D’s (which, I most certainly earned my Ph.D) and the MD title of “Dr.” This is not the issue. Yes..it is about salary. Ultimately, we all work to earn money. I left academe because I was disgusted at the lies and misinformation fed to young students about the
“possibilities” in higher education.
I did not have to leave academe. I chose to due to the hypocrisy. It is easy for those already tenured to “advse” others of job prospects in fields they know are extremely difficult to succeed in.
I don’t care if any of you doubt my credentials because I KNOW what I’ve earned and know that it is sad that so many students are brainwashed into thinking an MLS or a PH.D in history is worth the time when they could do other things that will actually get them a job.
So, make fun of me and doubt my MD degree and Ph.D. all you wish. I find it rather humorous to read the words of a few arrogant, liberal, academics thinking they have accomplished something be getting a paper title of “Dr”????
If most of you were forced to get job outside academe, you would probably fail miserably.
Being in the “world” of MD’s (along with my wife) we do not consider a silly Ph.D a “Doctor.” But, to massage your vanity and low self-esteem and low pay…call yourself whatever you wsh. You are not real Dr’s. I am…I’ve both a Ph.D. and an MD and, yes, I look down upon the closed minded world of academe.
At night, when you are alone with your thoughts…I know you feel underpaid. Well, grow up and if you want to truly earn the title of “Dr” then earn a medical degree. Otherwise, you are a whining group of people that real doctors laugh at. I find it the most admirable accomplishment of my life when I earned an MD…and, previously, a Ph.D.Yes…I’m a Dr…..and I just hope you will finally admit to your students that academe is NOT a good future….
And, yes….I love to know that I earn more in one year than it takes academics decades to make. It proves that I actually succeeded.
— Tim Harris Jun 4, 09:03 PM #
Wow, I am amazed Dr. Harris has time to read the Chronicle, parent a drooling 11 month old (up at night?), rant and rave online, and practice top-notch medicine. We are not worthy!
— Hetty Jun 4, 10:39 PM #
AAAAAnyway… back to the topic of the original column, my library tried advertising “roaming librarians” several times a semester, sending someone with a laptop into the computer lab, student union or dining hall. We did have conversations with students, but didn’t do much reference. I got the feeling that students in those spaces weren’t thinking of research, so weren’t prepared to take advantage of us. Regular office hours, in a physical office, could make a difference, though, by letting students and faculty know that this was a place to think of their research questions and to which they could come for help.
O.C., Ph.D.
(Who suspects that her thesis and her dissertation probably required much less editing than that of Tim Harris, Ph.D., M.D.)
— O.C. Jun 4, 10:51 PM #
I was hired in late 2004 (essentially, starting in Spring 2005) at Indiana University of Pennsylvania as the Science Librarian, which required me to split my time between an office in the library and an office in the Science building. It was successful, though it eventually stopped due to space needs for new hires.
— C. Clouser Jun 4, 10:58 PM #
Wow, all I can say is physician, heal thyself!
— smg Jun 5, 01:09 AM #
Tim Harris, Ph.D., M.D. == TROLL
Q.E.D.
— Alfonso El Sabio Jun 5, 08:59 AM #
I am sorry, Tim Harris, but I am going to have to “out” you on this board. You have no business posting here and hurling invectives at librarians who are trying to make a difference at their respective institutions.
Do you think we are all stupid to believe you spent 15+ years in graduate school? My stars, that would mean you are probably in your early 40’s and just getting your career started. I doubt it very much. You simply conflated your wife’s credentials with your inflated ones.
So, here’s what I think: I am pretty sure this is the same Tim Harris who posted on the Chronicle boards a while back ranting about affirmative action. I know you only have an MA degree in history from Eastern Kentucky University (a bottom tier history program!) and an MLS from University of Kentucky. You left academe because no decent PhD program would admit someone with a masters degree in that discipline from that school. Your wife is the one who has an MD. The reason why you have been unable to land a job after relocating to a state that had about 40 librarian openings last year is because you blew off interviews for jobs that weren’t good enough for you. You even use your wife’s pregnancy to lie and manipulate search committees—you used her labor (which wasn’t even true) as an excuse to blow off an interview at the last minute.
The only reason why I am posting this because I find your cruel intention to denigrate the library profession and earnest posters on this board appalling.
Of course, you will deny, deny, deny, but rest assured, if I see another post from you, I am going to report you to the Chronicle. If you are so angry about librarianship and academia, start another blog for other malcontents.
— Mr.Grieves Jun 5, 09:54 AM #
“I taught history at the college level for 4 years, worked as an academic librarian for 3 and the job market is so dismal…”
Tim’s illustrious career:
Adjuncted at EKU/and Chowan U-4 years
Academic Librarian at Chowan U (conservative Christian college, barely accredited)-3 years
— You're Busted Jun 5, 09:59 AM #
Dear Hetty, Alfonso, Alyssa, and other “Intellectuals,” with paper titles:
You sir/madaam, are a presumptuous little farts with an extraordinarily bloated and delusional sense of self-importance. Squatting in your office like the small, hermaphroditic toad on an academic lily pad that you are, you apparently pass the dull, meaningless hours in your life surveying your shabby little bureaucratic domain and desperately searching for someone who gives a shit what you “think”. I sir/madaam, unfortunately, am not that someone. If you were 1/10th as important and brilliant as you seem to think you are, I’d buy stock in your tight, constipated ass and then retire on the proceeds. Your remarks and actions indicate that, aside from being a dullard, you are an exceedingly sour, insecure, and a pedantic little person who has obviously done no more in your adult life other than grow old and intellectually stagnant while your arteries harden with increasing rapidity each and every day. Living with the constant awareness that your miserable, insignificant little “career” will most likely lead to an early heart attack (combined with constant worrying about why your wife or husband no longer likes you) has rendered you spiteful, rude, dull-witted, and vapid. Bitter and rejected by a backwards world which refuses to acknowledge your God-like brilliance, you lash out in close-minded fury while sporting a raging superiority complex for the few you have the “power” to screw, all the while obsessively adjusting the dust-covered diplomas which adorn the wall of your lair and nervously repeating to yourself that, contrary to what the painful knot in your gut tells you, your superiors really DON’T notice your inadequacies and incompetence. You fancy yourself a bold, skillful, and virile warrior in the clandestine and treacherous world of inter-office politics. How brave you must be! The hazards you must face every day! Indeed sir/madaam, we mere mortals should genuflect in humble and obsequious awe as your eminence, His/Her One And Only Royal Highness, (“He’s got a DOCTORATE, you know!”), The Mighty Hetty , Alfonso, Alyssa and other “intellectuals” graces us with their presence. Heroes of your ilk and sterling mettle are all too rare these days, and we from the lower strata of the evolutionary scale should count ourselves lucky and blessed that a person of your enormous courage, infallibility, and intellectual pomposity would deign to share the same planet with us. If the truth be told, only Valhalla would adequately suit a giant of your stature. There can be no doubt that ferocious and battle-hardened U.S. paratroopers and Special Forces (real patriots….unlike yourself) , fresh back from the brutal, blistering deserts of Iraq, would hang their heads in shame if confronted by such a stalwart and heroic icon of all that is good, decent, manly (or feminine), and right in America such as yourself. Indeed, this great nation needs more mousy, nervously perspiring, back-stabbing little two-bit bureaucratic drones such as yourself. Then we can pull our ragged, quasi-autistic, merely mortal children aside and whisper into their ears, “Look Johnny! There is Professor (insert your name…whomever is reading)-he/she is a DOCTOR, you know-if you behave yourself and study really, really hard and develop deep, all-consuming personal issues bordering on the schizophrenic, you too can one day be a cardboard hero and fight gallantly against imaginary enemies in the savage jungle of (insert your university’s name here), indeed!” In closing I would like to say that I do not usually spend five minutes formulating replies to bipedal orifices in suits, but you are such an outstanding example of a walking, prattling, female orifice that I felt compelled. May your wretched, diseased little soul eventually find some type of solace aside from hurling excrement at all those “beneath” you. Otherwise, I fear that one day, when your hypertension reaches critical proportions, the coroner shall have no choice other than to give you an enema and bury you in a shoebox. Good day to YOU, sir or madam.
With Utmost Sincerity,
“Tim Harris” An alias by the way…but still a person with both a Ph.D and an M.D.
— Tim Harris Jun 5, 10:06 AM #
Oh my…
I write this not intending to further engage a particular troll, but just as an observation: When I’ve spoken with people who’ve blamed affirmative action for their inability to get or hold an academic job, the aggrieved party has always displayed behaviors that I felt perfectly explained their inability to get hired, without requiring any help from minorities or “liberal” administrators. We see here a perfect example of what I mean.
I also find blaming affirmative action terribly ironic, as I’ve seen just as much sexism in the library world as I’ve seen anywhere else. I’m not targeting any particular male librarians here, but it does seem to me that there’s still a willingness to see men as having greater leadership ability, and then promoting them into higher positions, even when competing with equally qualified women. So, complaints from a male librarian of damage done by affirmative action strikes me as laughably implausible.
— O.C. Jun 5, 10:24 AM #
Dear Hetty, Alfonso, Alyssa, and other “Intellectuals,” with paper titles:
You sir/madaam, are presumptuous little farts with an extraordinarily bloated and delusional sense of self-importance. Squatting in your office like the small, hermaphroditic toad on an academic lily pad that you are, you apparently pass the dull, meaningless hours in your life surveying your shabby little bureaucratic domain and desperately searching for someone who gives a shit what you “think”. I sir/madaam, unfortunately, am not that someone. If you were 1/10th as important and brilliant as you seem to think you are, I’d buy stock in your tight, constipated ass and then retire on the proceeds. Your remarks and actions indicate that, aside from being a dullard, you are an exceedingly sour, insecure, and pedantic little person who has obviously done no more in your adult life other than grow old and intellectually stagnant while your arteries harden with increasing rapidity each and every day. Living with the constant awareness that your miserable, insignificant little “career” will most likely lead to an early heart attack (combined with constant worrying about why your wife or husband no longer likes you) has rendered you spiteful, rude, dull-witted, and vapid. Bitter and rejected by a backwards world which refuses to acknowledge your God-like brilliance, you lash out in close-minded fury while sporting a raging superiority complex for the few you have the “power” to screw, all the while obsessively adjusting the dust-covered diplomas which adorn the wall of your lair and nervously repeating to yourself that, contrary to what the painful knot in your gut tells you, your superiors really DON’T notice your inadequacies and incompetence. You fancy yourself a bold, skillful, and virile warrior in the clandestine and treacherous world of inter-office politics. How brave you must be! The hazards you must face every day! Indeed sir/madaam, we mere mortals should genuflect in humble and obsequious awe as your eminence, His/Her One And Only Royal Highness, (“He’s got a DOCTORATE, you know!”), The Mighty Hetty , Alfonso, Alyssa and other “intellectuals” graces us with their presence. Heroes of your ilk and sterling mettle are all too rare these days, and we from the lower strata of the evolutionary scale should count ourselves lucky and blessed that a person of your enormous courage, infallibility, and intellectual pomposity would deign to share the same planet with us. If the truth be told, only Valhalla would adequately suit a giant of your stature. There can be no doubt that ferocious and battle-hardened U.S. paratroopers and Special Forces (real patriots….unlike yourself) , fresh back from the brutal, blistering deserts of Iraq, would hang their heads in shame if confronted by such a stalwart and heroic icon of all that is good, decent, manly (or feminine), and right in America such as yourself. Indeed, this great nation needs more mousy, nervously perspiring, back-stabbing little two-bit bureaucratic drones such as yourself. Then we can pull our ragged, quasi-autistic, merely mortal children aside and whisper into their ears, “Look Johnny! There is Professor (insert your name…whomever is reading)-he/she is a DOCTOR, you know-if you behave yourself and study really, really hard and develop deep, all-consuming personal issues bordering on the schizophrenic, you too can one day be a cardboard hero and fight gallantly against imaginary enemies in the savage jungle of (insert your university’s name here), indeed!” In closing I would like to say that I do not usually spend five minutes formulating replies to bipedal orifices in suits, but you are such an outstanding example of a walking, prattling, female orifice that I felt compelled. May your wretched, diseased little soul eventually find some type of solace aside from hurling excrement at all those “beneath” you. Otherwise, I fear that one day, when your hypertension reaches critical proportions, the coroner shall have no choice other than to give you an enema and bury you in a shoebox. Good day to YOU, sir or madam.
With Utmost Sincerity,
“Tim Harris” An alias by the way.
— Tim Harris Jun 5, 10:26 AM #
Dear Hetty, Alfonso, Alyssa, and other “Intellectuals,” with paper titles:
You sir/madaam, are a presumptuous little farts with an extraordinarily bloated and delusional sense of self-importance. Squatting in your office like the small, hermaphroditic toad on an academic lily pad that you are, you apparently pass the dull, meaningless hours in your life surveying your shabby little bureaucratic domain and desperately searching for someone who gives a shit what you “think”. I sir/madaam, unfortunately, am not that someone. If you were 1/10th as important and brilliant as you seem to think you are, I’d buy stock in your tight, constipated ass and then retire on the proceeds. Your remarks and actions indicate that, aside from being a dullard, you are an exceedingly sour, insecure, and pedantic little person who has obviously done no more in your adult life other than grow old and intellectually stagnant while your arteries harden with increasing rapidity each and every day. Living with the constant awareness that your miserable, insignificant little “career” will most likely lead to an early heart attack (combined with constant worrying about why your wife no longer likes you) has rendered you spiteful, rude, dull-witted, and vapid. Bitter and rejected by a backwards world which refuses to acknowledge your God-like brilliance, you lash out in close-minded fury while sporting a raging superiority complex for the few you have the “power” to screw, all the while obsessively adjusting the dust-covered diplomas which adorn the wall of your lair and nervously repeating to yourself that, contrary to what the painful knot in your gut tells you, your superiors really DON’T notice your inadequacies and incompetence. You fancy yourself a bold, skillful, and virile warrior in the clandestine and treacherous world of inter-office politics. How brave you must be! The hazards you must face every day! Indeed sir/madaam, we mere mortals should genuflect in humble and obsequious awe as your eminence, His/Her One And Only Royal Highness, (“He’s got a DOCTORATE, you know!”), The Mighty Hetty , Alfonso, Alyssa and other “intellectuals” graces us with their presence. Heroes of your ilk and sterling mettle are all too rare these days, and we from the lower strata of the evolutionary scale should count ourselves lucky and blessed that a person of your enormous courage, infallibility, and intellectual pomposity would deign to share the same planet with us. If the truth be told, only Valhalla would adequately suit a giant of your stature. There can be no doubt that ferocious and battle-hardened U.S. paratroopers and Special Forces (real patriots….unlike yourself) , fresh back from the brutal, blistering deserts of Iraq, would hang their heads in shame if confronted by such a stalwart and heroic icon of all that is good, decent, manly (or feminine), and right in America such as yourself. Indeed, this great nation needs more mousy, nervously perspiring, back-stabbing little two-bit bureaucratic drones such as yourself. Then we can pull our ragged, quasi-autistic, merely mortal children aside and whisper into their ears, “Look Johnny! There is Professor (insert your name…whomever is reading)-he/she is a DOCTOR, you know-if you behave yourself and study really, really hard and develop deep, all-consuming personal issues bordering on the schizophrenic, you too can one day be a cardboard hero and fight gallantly against imaginary enemies in the savage jungle of (insert your university’s name here), indeed!” In closing I would like to say that I do not usually spend five minutes formulating replies to bipedal orifices in suits, but you are such an outstanding example of a walking, prattling, female orifice that I felt compelled. May your wretched, diseased little soul eventually find some type of solace aside from hurling excrement at all those “beneath” you. Otherwise, I fear that one day, when your hypertension reaches critical proportions, the coroner shall have no choice other than to give you an enema and bury you in a shoebox. Good day to YOU, sir or madam.
With Utmost Sincerity,
“Tim Harris” An alias by the way.
— Mark Harris Jun 5, 10:27 AM #
It’s funny what you can find via Google. Is this the same Tim Harris? Notice the similar syntax and sentiments. You are toast, my friend.
You decide:
Re: The price of affirmative action?
Author: Tim Harris, Eastern KY Uni.
Date: 11-09-04 10:32
Hello all,
I agree with Mr. Clegg on many points. First, affirmative action hurts more than it helps. In 1964, the Congress of the United States passed, and the President signed, a law that states emphatically that no person shall be discriminated against on the basis of color!
Yet, when any group (white, black, American Indian, or green…if there were such a group) receives special treatment I have yet to hear a single argument that reconciliates the 1964 act with contemporary Affirmative Action programs.
When applying to law school, medical school, graduate school, or a job, a person should be evaluated upon their ability to do the job and succeed. No one is holding African Americans back. I think Bill Cosby spoke the truth recently when he said that African American youth must stop playing “the victim.”
In my life as a professor in higher education, I can say that rascism flows both ways. Yes, there are whites who dislike other races. However, there are many, many African Americans who are just as rascist, if not more rascist, than whites.
My point: Rascism is wrong and it doesn’t matter whether you’re a Black American or white American.
I was recently turned down for a position at Eastern Kentucky University because they had to adhere to the “Kentucky Plan.”
What is this “plan?” Well, Mr. Clegg, I am sure, knows very well that this is reverse discrimination at its most venomous. The university, in MY OPINION ONLY (I want to stress that this is my opinon and I DO NOT put this forward as a scientific fact…again, only my personal opinion and experience) blatently disregarded the Civil Rights Act of 1964 by ordering members of a certain department to not consider ANYONE but African-American applicants even if this means lowering the standards to an “MA only” for a full-time faculty position.
Of course, this was sent around in a memorandum that was meant to be secret and was, to the chagrin of many university administrators, a major problem.
The memo, in essence, stated that the “Kentucky Plan” had to be met and that, it was to be understood, that an African-American would be a finalist for ANY position!!
Ok. If this potential applicant is the most qualified, then I think they should be hired…no questions asked. However, how many ABD’s in the U.S. and Ph.D’s applied for positions at EKU NOT REALIZING that their applications would end up in the trash can without EVEN BEING Considered!!
So, to some universities, affirmitive action means only helping African Americans. However, what about other minorities such as Native American Indians???
To use Eastern Kentucky University as an example, the memo I received clearly stated that no other minority, including Native American Indians, were to be considered for this full-time faculty position.
The administration’s logic was that they needed to “diversify” a certain department. OK. That is all fine. yet, why choose ONE MINORITY (I.E. AFRICAN AMERICANS) OVER ANOTHER MINORITY SUCH AS NATIVE AMERICAN INDIANS?????
I’m happy to share this memo with any person who might have applied for a full time position in American history at EKU during the 2002-2003 academic year.
Believe me, since I used to teach there, that you will be shocked. If there is any person who might have applied for a full-time position position as an assistant professor of history at EKU for the 2002-2003 academic year, then please let me know.
You’ll be shocked at the memo stating that, if you’re NOT of a specific race, then you shall not be a finalist.
I believe all people, regardless of race, should be given equal opportunity. Hiring should be a “color-blind” process.
I have attempted for months to figure out how the “Kentucky Plan” does not violate the Civil Rights Act of 1964. However, after completing 14 months of legal research, I concluded that it is in violation of the Civil Rights Act.
Again, if any person reading applied for a position at Eastern Kentucky University for a full-time position with a specialization in American history during the 2002-2003 academic year, then I’ll be happy to send this “secret memo” to you.
Let the world judge from this one example whether Affirmative Action is the right thing to do. It is not, in my humble opinion.
After all, WHAT IS WRONG with hiring faculty members on their credentials and NOT the color of their skin (whether their white, black, or any color)????????
I, again, say that the hiring of faculty should be a “color-blind” process.
I believe this to be fair to all.
— You're Busted Jun 5, 10:28 AM #
What a coincidence, the Tim Harris I know just happens to have all these things in common with what you have said about yourself in various posts (with a few substitutions) would have a kid the exact age you alluded to in your post, and has the exact same resentments and opinions. Would y’all believe this idiot sent a resentful ranting “sour grapes” letter with thinly veiled threats to sue the institution to the search committee of a job he was not hired for? I see white people employed all the time, yet it is only you who is held back by the injustice of affirmative action. Have you thought for one minute that you simply do not have the requisite skills (sorry dude, but FrontPage experience isn’t web design, nice try though)? No, that couldn’t be the case. It is everyone else who is an idiot.
— Mr.Grieves Jun 5, 10:35 AM #
“Indeed, this great nation needs more mousy, nervously perspiring, back-stabbing little two-bit bureaucratic drones such as yourself”
Hello pot, meet kettle. You have effectively described how you come across in an interview. Ah, the old adage “takes one to know one” applies! How’s the accumulation of adipose tissue these days? I know what you look like and you certainly aren’t the paragon of neither physical nor mental health, my friend.
“female orifice that I felt compelled…”
You’re a classy guy, to boot. I guess you didn’t mind accessing that “female orifice” to produce your demon spawn.
— Mr Grieves Jun 5, 10:44 AM #
<ROFL>
You didn’t tell us that you’re also a stand-up comedian Dr Tim! Thanks for a great laugh. Isn’t it interesting that those who are so insecure are the ones who make the most noise lambasting others?
With apologies to Monty Python, to quote the French fellows…I fart in your general direction
<laffing>
— Gary Jun 5, 10:45 AM #
Does anyone know what kind of doctor this guy is? I’m hoping for a specialty with very little exposure to patients. Like pathology.
— O.C. Jun 5, 11:23 AM #
Dr. Tim is a joke. I am a white male medical librarian, nearly 40 and I have had no trouble getting jobs. I can tell you this, there is nary a working MD in the country that has any time at all to post long rants on message boards. There are also few MD’s that talk about how much money they make as a sign of success. And before you assume I am some sort of feminized eunich or whatever (explaining why I am able to get jobs over a manly man like you in a feminized environment), I am a national class master’s endurance athlete. I consider being a librarian far more of a success than being the specie of doctor (which you are evidently not) who instinctively thinks the money is the metric for success in that field. My job affords me a decent salary, I get to be a part of the work doctors and medical researchers do, but I work strict 40 hour weeks leaving me free time for the manly pursuits you seem to fetishize but apparently don’t display. If I was home from my desk right now, I would certainly be engaged in something more vigorous than a Chronicle message board.
— Early Jun 5, 11:32 AM #
Dear Mr. Grieves,
I have never heard of an “EKU” until I just found it on the Internet. Seems like a nice university. However, I have no clue as to the person you are speaking of. Remember, this is a large nation and I would assume that this name is common. If this person sent, as you said, a “resentful ranting ‘sour grapes letter,’ then I don’t know what to say.I have no idea who you are but if this fellow has left such a long lasting memory upon you and your department, then….logic dictates that there was merit to his claim But, I can’t say this since I hae no relation to your “EKU”.
I did search and there is no “Mr. Grieves” in the faculty at EKU when you do a search.
But, if this person was an “idiot,” then how could he or she have ever taught for you?Doesn’t matter. I’m not this person….but, from my experience it is not uncommon for the liberal establishment at universities to discrimiate.
You can think I am Wyatt Earp and that is fine. But, if you were to actually have the courage to reveal your true name I bet there would be hundreds of people in this nation withe the same name.
A nice diversion tactic to avoid my original argument.
How pathetic.
— Tim Harris Jun 5, 11:40 AM #
Mr. Harris, you are more entertaining than Ignatius J. Reilly in A Confederacy of Dunces!
— CCH Jun 5, 11:47 AM #
“A nice diversion tactic to avoid my original argument.”
No, you are the troll here who has essentially eclipsed the discussion at hand with your resentful rants. If things truly worked out for you, then why are you even posting about librarianship on this thread. Why do you even care? Because you aren’t who you say your are. Logically, you will do whatever it takes to deflect, etc.
I don’t believe it for a minute that you made it through a PhD program—you cannot construct a simple, cohesive argument.
Don’t you have patients to see, “Dr. Tim”?
— Smack Down! Jun 5, 11:58 AM #
From UK’s Library School Alumni Page:
Tim Harris (’01) has been admitted to the PhD program in history at UK.
He never finished!
Oh, and check out his animus towards academic librarians in this context:
“You will see a high degree of ignorance amongst academic librarians of the need to spend money on chess books. Most view it as just a “game” and do not see it as we do and what I think needs to be done is to simply educate the academic library community of the relationship between chess and academic success.”
— Fraud Jun 5, 12:09 PM #
Dude, don’t mess with librarians. Librarians can find sh*t out.
— O.C. Jun 5, 12:12 PM #
First, I have time because of this thing known as “vacation.” Next, for the bloated egos posting…“out” yourself or anyone you wish that you have a vendetta against. Truly, it will not effect my pay nor sleep. I do think it quite unethical to be throwing names around when you have no empirial evidence that that person made posts here.
I merely find it amusing to spar with such inferior minds.An to the “here’s what I think”…you can degrade someone else all you wish It only shows your little mind and to say that this person used his wife’s pregnancy to avoid job interviews is so far out of line since you don’t know who I am, I’m hoping the person you are speaking of reads this.
You coward! You dare make such accusations as “You even use your wife’s pregnancy to lie and manipulate search committees—you used her labor (which wasn’t even true) as an excuse to blow off an interview at the last minute.”
I do not know this person. However, I find it completely childish for you, being such a “glowing intellectual,” to speak of people in a public forum that you have no clue as to if this is them or not.
Typical of a person with personality disorder NOS. An inflated ego, lashing out in a “Fight or flight” reaction which, in this case, is “Fight” (verbally). Very primitive emotions at work. Attempt to be more Stoic….if you even know what this is. Oh, since I have an MLS…I’ll take the “pepsi Challenge” with any idiot on this board that claim to have earned this degree. Yes, we librarians know how to find information. You can call this other person a Martian….I don’t care. I don’t know this person.
Again, you can call me any name you want….but my original argument was that higher education isn’t a good future for many students.
“out me?” Oh, please do! You don’t even know where I’m from or who I am. Abuse this other fellow’s name all you wish. I don’t care.But, “out me” if you can. What idiots. I’ve looked up the publishing record of the EKU professors and I see nothing but second grade regurgitations of graduate school papers.
If you were real “scholars” then you would not be at a second rate institution such as EKU.
Thankfully, I never had any affiliation with this low grade school and so- called “doctors.”
You are so pathetic. But, so be it Throw your insults and it just makes you look worse than you already are…“Doctor.”This makes a fascinating study in human behavior….
keep it up. I find it quite interesting as to the world view of Ph.D’s an their inflated egos and need to be called “Dr” rather than “Mr” or “Ms”…you are not a “Dr” untill you receive a medical degree.
Everyone else is just a piece of paper and an ego.
Good bye, dear “Dr’s” and I’ll see if your name, being a “Dr” shows up in JAMA or the New England Journa of Medicine.
Otherwise, your “Mr,” “Ms,” or a combination of both……Sorry, but my vacation will soo be over and shan’t have the thrill of speaking with half wit, ego twisted, paper “Dr’s.”
What was it Spock said….“Live long and Prosper.”
— Tim Harris Jun 5, 12:36 PM #
Posting rants to the Chronicle—What a sad way to spend one’s vacation, “Dr Tim”!
“Sorry, but my vacation will soo be over and shan’t have the thrill of speaking with half wit, ego twisted, paper “Dr’s.”
Did anyone here claim to have a PhD? You are clearly delusional.
Actually, this is precisely how your responses can be characterized : “An inflated ego, lashing out in a “Fight or flight” reaction which, in this case, is “Fight”
If you really thought we were all inferior beings, “female orifices”, or whatever juvenile invective suits your mood, you would not post here any more. If this stuff amuses you, then you are really a sad individual.
— Androgynous Jun 5, 12:57 PM #
Dear Mr. Grieves,
I’m still waiting for you to “out” me. I quote your words, “I am sorry, Tim Harris, but I am going to have to “out” you on this board. You have no business posting here and hurling invectives at librarians who are trying to make a difference at their respective institutions.”Do not be sorry since I am not the person you are speaking of. However, please “out” me ASAP. You can’t. You are a typical troll patrolling this site for arguments.
Yet, I’m looking forward to your “proof” and your “outing” this person.I do hope someday he reads this. I don’t think any person would like their name degraded as you have his. If you have proof….then, show it to the world.
Otherwise, you’re just another simple minded person with a grievance against someone with the same name.
Well…I’m looking forward to your “proof” and your “outing” anyone. You’re just making a bigger fool of yourself than you already are. But, please…..“out” me and this person you have a vendetta against.Let’s see…this person you speak of was a graduate of EKU with an MA in history. Yes…librarians can find information and I think this person might want to know that his name is being insulted by some idoots at this little place called “EKU.”
There can only be so many people in this nation with that name. I don’t know his middle name but I think this person deserves to know that some silly knaves from an insignificant university is insulting him to the world..and as “OC” said, “Dude, don’t mess with librarians. Librarians can find sh*t out.”I find this remark quite childish and that of an insecure person with low self-esteem. Yet, it(that is, “he”, “she” or a combination of both being “it” ) is correct…we librarians can find information.
I wonder what this person you are degrading will think of these posts?
Where ever he is, if he is not deceased, can be found. I’ll see if I can find this person as their are many hints in previous posts as to where or what this person might now be doing. If I find him, I wonder what he will think of your words….you people are so, well, stupid and foolish. You are so pathetic it sickens me to even think of your vile words. But, I said I used an alias…and for you to smear the name of this other person is not exactly the smartest thing to do. If he is alive, he can be found. And, he will be alerted of these comments…..all I have to go on is that this person was an EKU graduate with a history degree and went to UK, also. Can’t be too hard to narrow down…for a professional librarian as the previous idiot “librarian” mentioned.
Perhaps this person needs to be told that his name is being slandered by bufoons such as you. The name is quite common. Just use librarian techniques and you’ll see that out of an America with a 300 million population…..many people have this name.
But, thank you for informing me of this person and details of where he graduated and what year and what subject he received his degrees in.
It narrows my search tremendously and he should know what you “Dr’s” have been saying using his name. Yes, librarians can— Tim Harris Jun 5, 01:27 PM #
Right on, Bro. Stick it to the man. Find out how to contact that Tim Harris cat and tell him about how everyone here is dissing him. Too much bad karma here. You need to smoke a bowl and chill.
— Acoustic Grass Odyssey Jun 5, 01:46 PM #
Tim,
I want to give you an opportunity to respond to a specific argument minus the hostility.
You have pointed out that salary determines one’s level of success. Given this criteria, you are more successful than most of us in academia and less successful than many in the business world. But is salary the best measure of success? Isn’t there something valuable and worthwhile about a profession (any profession) that provides a modest income, but also allows one to help others, learn new things, mentor young people, read, and write? Can’t one trade an opportunity to acquire a grand salary for a job that allows one a great degree of freedom and autonomy? Why is it a failure to choose a profession that may not allow one to buy lots of things or travel to far away places, but allows one to be free of being on-call?
You accuse those of us who work at universities of being fools because we value something other than money.
If you decided to dedicate your life to serving the underserved, taking only a modest salary, would you consider yourself a failure?
So,is Bill Gates more successful than, say, a high school teacher who chooses to change the life of a struggling teenager, or a counselor who turned a kid away from drugs, or a minister who comforts a grieving widow? Would the teenager, the drug-free kid,or the widow think that the teacher, the counselor, or the minister are failures?
I suppose I’m surprised that a physician like yourself who spends his days improving the health of others thinks so little of the service you provide. Are you a success because you make hundreds of thousands of dollars or because you bring babies into this world, restore a beating heart, help someone walk again, or cut away a tumor?
Would your trade your family, friendships, passions, free time for money?
Now, I’m not suggesting that it’s always an either/or proposition, and I’m not suggesting that a physician can’t enjoy something other than money, but I’m trying to understand what makes you tick.
I would say,of course, that you, as a physician, are a success to the degree that you improve the lives of others, but what do you say?
— blague Jun 5, 04:47 PM #
Tim,
Are you a MD and a PhD? I was just checking. I wasn’t sure. Can you please tell me if you are? Thank you. I look forward to hearing if you are a MD and a Phd. Please let me know. Thanks for letting me know if you are a PhD or MD.
lol!
— Tony Jun 5, 07:15 PM #
Also do you have an MLIS? Thank you for your time. I hope you answer me because I am a minority. Well, I guess because of affirmative action that would put me first in line for getting my question answered. Thank you Dr. Dr. You have a Phd and MD right. Oh wait, I guess it should just be Dr. since the Phd does not mean “Dr.”.
— Tony Jun 5, 07:26 PM #
Tim Harris is in the way of genuine discussion. Can’t the Chronicle edit for nuisance postings like this? Its funny at first but then becomes tedious.
btw, I have only a humble masters degree but I’d love to be a librarian. (these days you need an MLS and an MS).My librarian friends have tenure, good salaries and benefits and they can travel overseas every summer. Most importantly, they can do something meaningful by helping people. I just write computer programs to process meaningless data that helps administrators feel in control.
— clk Jun 5, 08:02 PM #
“What idiots. I’ve looked up the publishing record of the EKU professors and I see nothing but second grade regurgitations of graduate school papers.
If you were real “scholars” then you would not be at a second rate institution such as EKU.”
I love this. He thinks Mr.Grieves is affiliated with EKU. What is really suspicious here is that at first he claims to never have heard of EKU, but in a subsequent post, furiously unleashes insults upon history faculty like a scorned lover. This guy probably was affiliated with EKU at some point. Otherwise, why would he care?
Well, if you aren’t the Tim Harris formerly of EKU, you should get in touch with this guy. Apparently, you have the same writing style (promiscuous use of capital letters), resent minorities, and both didn’t complete a PhD at UK. You both seem to resort to “sour grapes” when things don’t go your way. Upon rejection, the other “Tim” likes to write letters to search committees bragging that his wife makes so much money anyway and that he doesn’t need to work, but CHOOSES (yeah, he used caps here, too) to work. Perhaps, you can collaborate on a scintillating paper disparaging the library field or whatever and bond over the fact that you are both unemployed.
The laughable thing here is that everyone seemed to overlook what it takes to get into med school. High GPA and MCAT score. Very few humanities people are able to do well enough in organic chem and physics and have that translate into a strong MCAT score. We are supposed to believe that after years spend in a history doctoral program, you shifted gears and took all the med school prerequisites. Sure.
— C.Jones Jun 6, 09:35 AM #
After monitoring this discussion I find it rather interesting that their are so many people interested in what Mr. Harris has to say. I did find post #36 quite funny as I know it must have made many professors mad. Or else, why even respond?
This guy is basically just saying that the job market is bad for people wanting to go into the field of library science or history. This person could be anyone or no one. Then again, so could the people that post under alias names claiming to be working at universities. I’m don’t work at a university but I try to keep up with things dealing with post-secondary education.
If there was no merit to what this person says, then why do you even respond? From my experience professors are supposed to be logical and be impartial and if they perceive an insult, then ignore it. But none of you are doing this. Why?
If you don’t like what you read, then ignore it. A part of me, though, cannot see why university teachers see this person endlessly interesting. You do, though, as this person’s remarks have evoked some apparently primitive emotions in peopel that supposed to be governed by logic. This doesn’t make sense. You keep find this person interesting like a particularly gruesome scab that you simply can’t help picking at!
Why? Just let go and ignore it. I disagree with what this person is saying but it is true that, from my experience in college, many teachers were smug and much too confident. It just surprises me that so many would take so much interest in someone that obviously irritates you so much. Usually, a person doesn’t get this irritated unless there is some truth in what their adversary says.
I don’t know. But, that’s my five cents worth. And, I’m a nobody but it seems that it’s all come down to a childish school yard game of name calling. For both sides. Seems pretty simple to me. If you don’t like what is being said, then ignore it. If you choose to respond then you are allowing your own emotions to supersede your logic.
Anyway…how does anyone here know that the ones that claim to be librarians or professors are really who they say they are? using an alias is easy…but I can say I’m “Thomas Evans” and I bet there’s a thousand people with that name that do a similar job as myself. it all comes down to this: If you don’t like what someone says, then ignore it. The chronicle is a place that claims to be a format for “free speech” and all that fancy stuff. Well, everyone has a right to say what they want. It seems this person is only hurting peoples’ ego and that does not warrant a response.You are obviously allowing your emotions to govern your thoughts and actions by merely responding.
Let it go….and get on with the original discussion.
— Anon Jun 6, 08:11 PM #
I also wanted to add some additional remarks. This is in response to C. Jones who says, “ Upon rejection, the other “Tim” likes to write letters to search committees bragging that his wife makes so much money anyway and that he doesn’t need to work, aid in post #59 that…“you can collaborate on a scintillating paper disparaging the library field or whatever and bond over the fact that you are both unemployed.”
There is hardly such thing as an unemployed M.D. and you know it. There are many unemployed people with doctorates…but an M.D.? No…extremely improbable. So, what I discern from C. Jones remarks are nothing but blind emotion exploding outward toward some person you hate. I’m not an M.D but I know that they have far more opportunities than a librarian. So, for C. Jones to presume or state as fact that this person’s wife is not employed being what you admit is an M.D., then it is you that are delusional. Look at the stats….how any unemployed, homeless M.D’s are there? It’s true that M.D’s make in a year more than a college teacher makes in several years. So, to insult someone’s wife is only shows that you are jealous of the fact that physicians make so much more money than a college teacher. And, as I said earlier, considering that anyone can post here and not using their real name the everyone is suspect when it comes to what they claim to do fora living. I’d bet their are people here that claim to be colllege teachers and are not.Just ignore what you don’t like to hear. Pretty simple. But, I wonder if anyone here is either a college teacher or anything else.
College teachers shouldn’t, if any of you are really colllege teachers, even respond to someone that apparently has made such a huge mark upon your life.
This entire forum is a disgrace. Not from some disgruntled person but from the responses from the people claiming to be college teachers. By responding to this person, you are only reinforcing what was said in post # 39.So, this person has, in effect, exposed the childiish emotions just waiting to burst in college teachers.
He actually has done what others can rarely do: Make college teachers spout childish remarks and prove that they are no better than someone that works at McDonalds.
I did say to just forget this person…but for some odd reason, no one can. And this only makes you suspect. My professors ( I hope) would never even respond to such posts. So, either everyone here is a liar or just can’t control their emotiions. But, keep it going…it is humorous.— Anon Jun 6, 08:56 PM #
I believe you have misunderstood what C. Jones was suggesting – not that the wife is unemployed, but that “Tim Harris,” who has been commenting on this post, and “Tim Harris,” who has apparently caused a similar ruckus elsewhere, are both unemployed. Perhaps you should read more carefully before casting aspersions and hurling insults?
— anon, too Jun 7, 11:44 AM #
I’m very suspicious that someone would take that much time (and verbiage) to support “Dr” Harris. I don’t think you have to be a real Einstein to figger out that “anon” and Tim Harris are one and the same. “Dr“Harris is a real dirtbag, a discredited professional student who has to blame other people for his failure as an academic, mooching off his wife and throwing sexist and racist tantrums. Good riddance to bad rubbish, as they used to say.
— Peter W Jun 9, 03:31 PM #
Personally, I think it’s great that academic librarians hold office hours. Any extra visibility that academic librarians – or any librarian for that matter – can get is fantastic. Librarianship as a whole is still fighting to rid itself of the “shhhing” image (though it is still fun to joke about every so often).
Through no fault of their own, I think that academic librarians are probably considered by the outside world the most formidable (in the not-so-good-way) librarians around just because academic libraries are fairly sizable for the most part. As an MLS grad student, I even found them imposing. No one wants to look ignorant in front of those who are the experts in their field. (Dr. Tim is doing a bang up job though.)
And I don’t know what Dr. Tim was smoking the day that he met with an advisor that apparently told him that librarianship would make him the big bucks – which seems to be his life goal & now has accomplished. I don’t remember any professor or advisor of mine misleading me into the impression that I would become rich in this profession. It would be like saying social workers are millionaires – absurd.
Dr. Tim does seem to be interested in playing games. So Dr. Tim, I see your [Freudian] large salary and raise you one more literate child.
But back on track… academic librarians around the world: united and fight for office hours! Be human and be seen! Don’t become a Dr. Tim and don’t be afraid to be “poorly” paid!
BTW, I’m not an academic librarian, in case anyone cares.
— spazzy jazzy Jun 9, 03:58 PM #
No more liberal narrow minded insults? It is a shame. I so enjoyed interacting wth inferior minds.
Perhaps again….in the years ahead. Who knows? It has been fun…to each…remember….vote McCain!
— Republican Jun 23, 09:38 PM #