January 9, 2008

Thousands of Arizona College Students Denied In-State Tuition

While Arizona’s major public universities have had to reclassify hundreds of students from in-state to out-of-state status under a 2006 immigration law, the number is in the thousands for the state’s community colleges, The Arizona Republic reported today.

In all, nearly 4,000 students in the state’s colleges and universities were denied in-state tuition this year and are being charged rates that in some cases are more than three times as high. The law, Proposition 300, requires students to document that they are in the United States legally before they can receive in-state rates.

Arizona’s largest community-college district, the Maricopa County Community Colleges, had the most students who could not document their legal status, with 1,720. The University of Arizona and Arizona State University had earlier numbered their reclassified students only in the hundreds. —Katherine Mangan

Comments

1. Even when I was growing up there, Arizona could not have existed without undocumented workers who performed work that “legal” workers wouldn’t do; it is apalling that the children of those workers – who fuel important sectors of the economy there – are denied affordable access to higher education.

   — TDD    Jan 9, 03:39 PM    #

2. I agree with TDD that it is a shame that these undocumented students must pay a price for their immigration status when they and their families often have contributed so much to our economy. But the negative economic and security impacts of illegal immigration are hurting us all and these impacts will continue to escalate in the future if something is not done to stem the tide of illegal immigration. Someone will ultimately have to pay a price to right this situation and I say a remedy is long overdue.

   — md    Jan 9, 03:48 PM    #

3. The overwhelming majority of those who enter the US illegally do so to take advantage of the socioeconomic infrastructure that citizens and those who entered the country legally have built. In this respect they resemble people who cut in the front of a line at the theater or at an off-ramp on a crowded highway—they are cheats. As a society, we have an obligation to stop cheaters, so Arizona’s enforcement of the law should be applauded and duplicated nationwide. The fact that illegals supposedly “contribute” to society no more justifies their cheating than does the fact that someone who cuts the line at a theater pays for a ticket.

   — James    Jan 9, 03:52 PM    #

4. As a DSO, I have to make sure that any international student is here correctly: either under the appropriate visa or as LPR. It’s only a matter of time before DHS makes institutions liable for students attending without appropriate paperwork. I don’t blame Arizona for doing this – and remember that the schools are just following the rules placed by others. But regardless of whether the student is here “legally” or “illlegally” (and let’s not get into an argument on the terms, please?) if any student cannot provide documentation that they meet residency requirements, they should not receive the tuition discount.

   — Tracy G    Jan 9, 03:53 PM    #

5. The problem with having undocumented workers is that it makes what would ordinarily be an effective economic transaction (they need the work; we need the labor) and turns the entire situation into a venue of criminality. If we had a documented guest worker program all participants would prosper. Surely, businesses and the communities benefiting from guest workers would be more inclined to support living and working conditions for their economic partners. We really need cogent, comprehensive legislation in this area.

   — JEH    Jan 9, 04:02 PM    #

6. In the “publicly” funded HED systems of many states, reimbursement formulae lead to state contributions of 30 cents to 50 cents of each dollar budgeted; the remainder coming from other sources. Other sources at the CC level include real estate taxes, special taxes and tuition and fees. I would that posit that all students living in a district do pay a significant amount of HED-associated costs in one way or another. Perhaps the classification is specious given that all students pay some tuition. If the issue is one of lost revenues, how will AZ replace revenues that will be lost by this reclassification which will result in significant loss of both head count and credit count?

   — anne    Jan 9, 04:35 PM    #

7. Nativism and racism are as “American as Apple Pie.” Once upon a time the most distiguished leaders of the Arizona Territory were Spanish. Indeed, the United States stole most of Arizona from Mexico and purchased the bottom tier. As a nation, we once feared the Black Irish and then the Italians and the Chinese and the Japanese — and of course, always the Blacks. This latest form of nativism is a great sadness. I was honored to serve on the Faculty of Political Science at the University of Arizona early in my career, and I remember Tucson with a special affection. I wish the Know-Nothings and Hate-Mongers would leave Arizona alone. Indeed, I wish they would stop abusing their fellow human beings.
   Don Freeman

   — Donald M. Freeman    Jan 9, 05:56 PM    #

8. Some things are right; some things are wrong. Too many people cannot tell the difference in large part due to their upbringing , training or education. So much for education.

   — Etta B    Jan 9, 06:25 PM    #

9. I don’t buy James’ analogy that illegal immigrants are like people who cut the line at the theater. In my mind, it’s more like this: We invited these people into the theater lobby through the side door, told them to sweep up the popcorn, and now we won’t let them (or their kids) see the movie. The fact is, we share responsibility for their being here. If we want them to go to the back of the line, that’s fine — let’s just be honest about why we’ve been letting them in the side door for so long, and let’s give them a real chance of getting in to the movie from the back of the line.

   — JSS    Jan 9, 06:34 PM    #

10. I teach in Arizona’s community college system which has been hit so hard by this new law. In the midst of the complex issue of illegal immigration, the simplistic slap against immigrants who are trying to improve their lives and contribute to our country by going to college raises many questions. Why punish the kids going to college? Why not punish criminals or drop outs? Why make it economically impossible for immigrants to attend college? Why hit the community colleges which serve many students who cannot go to universities? Those who sit in other regions of the country judging an issue they do not understand may soon find it impacting their schools, too. Do you really think they will stop with Arizona?

    — Anne Robey-Graham    Jan 9, 06:49 PM    #

11. Ironically, Cesar Chavez was a leader of the fight against the earlier “guest worker” program that admitted “braceros” to work temporarily in the US. His goal was to increase wages of those legal Mexican immigrants dependent on farm labor. Perhaps we need amend the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA) to add a policy for working or studying across borders (Canadian, US, and Mexico) in a systematic way. However, so long as “out of state” fee differentials exist in most US states (unlike Canadian provinces), there is still that issue to tackle.

    — Stephen Lawton    Jan 9, 06:56 PM    #

12. I would like to point out that there are several excellent universities in Mexico, Ecuador, Costa Rica, etc. that educate thousands of students. Why should my taxes go to pay for a college education for a student who will only graduate and will not be legally allowed to work in this country?

    — Meredith    Jan 9, 08:05 PM    #

13. I am a tax-paying and law-abiding US citizen. I pay out-of-state tuition for my 3 children. Why does an illegal immigrant get priveleges that we do not?

    — debster    Jan 9, 09:50 PM    #

14. Every time you eat lettuce you buy at low cost at the grocery store, you are taking advantage of the illegal immigrants who are exploited on your behalf by agribusiness owners who are not held accountable for hiring undocumented workers. In many instances, these businesses pay wages that are far below what would be required to pay legal workers, and they often provide substandard working conditions as well, relying on the illegal status of their work forces to keep complaints to a minimum. Unless you’re willing to demand higher priced, legal US labor-grown produce and other products, as well as higher cost services (like, for instance, the next time you attend a professional conference), it strikes me as hypocritical to demand that undocumented workers ‘pay a price’. We are shifting the burden of our privileged lives onto them, pure and simple, and then punishing them for trying to get ahead.

    — Bob    Jan 10, 06:24 AM    #

15. While everyone is entitled to their own opinion, people are not entitled to their own sets of facts.

    1. Arizona and any other state can exist just fine without criminal aliens.

    2. Wanting people to obey the law and immigrate using the proper process is neither racist nor “nativist.”

    3. Criminal aliens are criminals whether they stay in school or drop out, whether they work or take welfare.

    The taxpayers of Arizona have a right to make sure that their hard earned dollars, confiscated at the point of a gun by the government, are at least spent for legitimate needs, not to benefit criminals and in fact, make breaking the law all the more attractive.

    — Bill    Jan 10, 08:21 AM    #

16. Arizona Law has prohibited those without lawful status from being classified as an in-state resident for years, since 1996. See the Illegal and Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act of 1996.

    The new part of the law is actually to prevent colleges and universities from going around this law and award these students STATE-FUNDED grants, scholarships, and tuition waivers.

    And for those who do not know, the difference between in-state and out-of-state tuition prices is paid with STATE funds.

    Basically, this law only prevents students from receiving STATE AID.

    And, I don’t know about you, but I believe Arizona is right in not wanting its STATE monies to go to AID people who cannot legally give back to the state.

    But then again, neither does the US government…which is why students in this status do not qualify for FEDERAL AID programs.

    — ER    Jan 10, 10:00 AM    #

17. You’re not a racist or hatemonger for wanting equal treatment under the law.

    Eating no lettuce doesn’t compensate for paying out-of-state tuition.

    Providing in-State tuition to undocumented students doesn’t alleviate exploitation of farm workers or increase their pay.

    Some of the comments here would be laugable if they weren’t so appallingly ill-thought.

    — wm    Jan 10, 10:23 AM    #

18. America (south and north) used to be a great place to live and work. That is until the illegal creation of the United States.

    — BC    Jan 10, 10:41 AM    #

19. I thought we believed, as a country, that providing education to those with whom we live improves all our lives. This is not a question of what any individual deserves but rather of what we as a country continually hope to be.

    I would hope that the generation of students now in college or who should be in college receives an education that enables them to alleviate exploitation and to increase their pay and the standard of living of their — and our — families… and that helps them understand the short-sightedness and ultimate broad harm of selfish, mean-spirited laws.

    — anne    Jan 10, 11:08 AM    #

20. Most people are willing to grant that we need control of our borders. For the protection of citizens and non-citizens alike, we need to know who is here and where. Non-citizens need some legalized status so that they can avail themselves, at the very least, of the protection of the law. But I’ve got to tell you that the overt mean-spiritedness, xenophobia, and longing to restore “white” America of the major propopnents of this legislation make me not want to agree with them about anything. I recognize that one does not truly address the positions of those with whom we disagree by attacking their motives. But that is a two way street. The real problem in AZ is that what the parties to this debate really disagree about is their basic value systems. Illegal immigration is just the current whipping boy.

    — Dave    Jan 10, 11:37 AM    #

21. No Dave. You are wrong. Criminal aliens do have a legal status . . . in their home country. And they should avail themselves of it at their earliest opportunity. It’s not mean spiritedness to insist that those who immigrate here do so according to the law. What is mean spirited is that you and others would turn a blind eye to criminal activity to the detriment of those who live here legally. And the worst thing about it is the liberal’s blatant attempt to make this about race. This isn’t about race, Dave. . . it’s about the law. Doesn’t matter if the criminal alien is from Ireland or Canada or Mexico or Russia or wherever. . . Doesn’t matter if the criminal alien is black or brown or yellow or white. This is a country of laws. . . and those not here legally should be deported. And it’s easy to do. . .

    No more welfare. . .no more free medical. . .no more free education. . . no more sanctuary. . .no more anything! Corporate or business leaders who are responsible for hiring criminal aliens should be jailed. Those who rent to criminal aliens should be jailed. Take away all the reasons for coming here illegally and not only will the flow stop, the criminal aliens who are already here will leave in short order.

    My roots are those of a legal immigrant. . .the mother of my children is a legal immigrant. . . This country has always welcomed legal immigrants and it always should. Criminal aliens belong in jail or deported, not getting a free ride in our colleges.

    — Bill    Jan 10, 12:35 PM    #

22. So, Bob (post #14) ... All agri-workers are undocumented? Every single picker of vegetables are illegal aliens? Every one? Hmm..

    — Legal Immigant    Jan 10, 01:07 PM    #

23. Yup, if we get to pick and choose what laws to follow and those to ignore, I want to ignore those from the IRS (Treasury). Would you mind cutting me the same slack you want to offer these individuals? Hey, I am fairly productive; I contribute to society and do a job someone else doesn’t want to do. I even have insurance so I won’t be a burden to your taxes for indigent care. Also, I am green so I should be considered a protected class, disadvantaged even.

    I think what the folks in Arizona are doing wrong is they don’t have ICE (Immigration) standing by to arrest and deport folks that can prove their legal right to be here. Is that harsh? I think that is the law.

    Oops, I forget, we get to pick and choose.

    Keep repeating to yourself (or even better, ALOUD)…illegal, illegal, illegal

    — Pick N Choose    Jan 10, 01:40 PM    #

24. Well, gee, if undocumented foreigners can go to state colleges and pay in-state tuition, does that mean that I, as an American born in Connecticut, can go to a state college in Arizona and pay in-state tuition too? Or is that benefit only supposed to be for illegal immigrants? Do you know of any other countries that will allow undocumented foreigners to attend their higher-educational institutions with the same benefits as the local nationals? As for the argument that we stole all our land from others a century and a half ago, anybody can make a silly and specious argument like that. Singapore used to belong to Malaysia, but now it’s a sovereign nation, and that’s that. So what?

    — Scott Soutu    Jan 10, 03:32 PM    #

25. Remember this. No one is denying the students access to the universities.I agree with Scott. If a student for example lives in Florida and goes to a college in Arizona they have to pay out of state tuition. I moved to California and had to wait 1 year before I could attend Ca.State under in state tuition. I am a citizen of this country and pay taxes and have insurance.I am a teacher myself and it has been difficult to explain what the word illegal means. Cocaine is an illegal drug and people are arrested if they are in possession of it so why are people who are ILLEGAL not arrested if they cannot verify their status

    — Concearned    Jan 10, 03:57 PM    #

26. Because the highly charged phrase “criminal alien” is being used, would someone with actual knowledge of the law please describe the difference between criminal and civil immigration law? I just participated in a proceeding where a 23 year old man, brought here by his parents at age 7, was brought before a federal judge after being apprehended at a work site. The judge made it clear that it was a civil, not a criminal proceeding.

    — kevin    Jan 10, 04:48 PM    #

27. Re Post #22: I don’t believe I ever suggested that all agricultural workers were undocumented. However, it is beyond dispute that many are. The point I was trying to make is that many agricultural and service businesses take advantage of laws that make undocumented workers vulnerable to exploitation, and that we are the beneficiaries of the Catch-22 conditions that our laws encourage. It takes two to tango—if there were no work available to undocumented aliens, the issue would be much diminished. Until I see a parallel movement to harshly punish employers who knowingly hire undocumented workers, I will maintain that we’re being hypocritical.

    — Bob    Jan 11, 05:50 AM    #

28. As to mean-spiritedness, I rest my case.

    — Dave    Jan 11, 11:52 AM    #

29. Legal aliens, who have followed the law, paid the fees, waited their turn, completed the paperwork and otherwise done things the right way should be heard. What message does the U.S. send when it promotes the interests of those who cheat ahead of those who follow the rules?

    ugh. don’t answer that.

    — C.S.Nunis    Jan 14, 11:11 AM    #

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