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December 6, 2007

Some Arizona University Programs Threatened by Proposed Ban on Affirmative Action

The Phoenix-based Goldwater Institute has issued a report listing several Arizona university programs as vulnerable to legal challenge if voters there bar public colleges and other state agencies from using racial, ethnic, and gender preferences.

Ward Connerly, who played a key role in the successful campaigns to persuade California, Michigan, and Washington State voters to ban affirmative-action preferences, has named Arizona as one of five states where he hopes to get similar measures on the ballot in November 2008.

In a report issued this week, the libertarian-leaning Goldwater Institute says, “The question of whether Arizona should ban racial classifications is not an abstraction. Public officials at every level of Arizona government have resorted to classifying their constituents on the basis of race, color, national origin, and sex, and have apportioned opportunities on that basis.”

In terms of employment, the Arizona Board of Regents has a policy stating that public colleges should give preference to job candidates from certain racial and ethnic groups in order, the policy says, to “correct underutilization as identified in university affirmative-action plans.”

Northern Arizona University’s affirmative-action policy “specifies percentage goals for women and minorities in certain jobs and establishes methods for meeting those goals,” while the University of Arizona’s affirmative-action office sets goals for minority hiring for certain job groups, the Goldwater Institute report says.

The state universities also have many programs for students that use racial preferences, including a University of Arizona office devoted to recruiting students from certain minority groups and a Northern Arizona University program that provides academic assistance to freshmen and uses race as a criterion for acceptance, the report says.

A statement issued by the Goldwater Institute says “government entities are rarely candid about whether and the extent to which they confer preferences on the basis of race, color, or sex,” so the programs listed in its report “may represent only the tip of the Arizona preference iceberg.” —Peter Schmidt

Comments

1. Theses efforts really worry me – there are some areas – particularly in student recruitment and retention – where the community has a clear need for such efforts. This is particularly true in health professions – where the research clearly demonstrates that health outcomes are improved when the providers of health care “look like” the recipients of those health care services. I grew up in Arizona and seldom agreed with Barry Goldwater, after whom I assume this institute is named. But on this matter, I think he’d be ashamed to have his name associated with this effort!

   — TDD    Dec 6, 03:45 PM    #

2. I’m still waiting to hear Mr. Connerly’s alternative approach to increasing the numbers of underrepresented ethnic groups participatiing in any institution; with the exception of prisons of course.

   — Raymond    Dec 6, 04:17 PM    #

3. WA passed its law several years ago (prohibiting consideration of race or ethnicity)...but “goals” were still OK, and would be in Arizona. The methods must comply with state law, but the aims may remain.

   — dg    Dec 6, 04:28 PM    #

4. In order to avoid conflicts regarding affirmative action, perhaps colleges and universities should recruit and select for admission the most qualified students, regardless of race or ethnicity, just as they do in their athletic programs. We don’t hear many calls for affirmative action in college athletics, so they must be doing something right. Right?

   — BKD    Dec 6, 04:31 PM    #

5. A proimising compromise to race/gender based Affirmative Action (AA) is social class-based AA. Polls show broad-based support for this approach. A new AA could help economically disadvantged students, regardless of race or gender. The University of Michigan, Ann Arbor is already using this new policy in undergraduate admissions.

   — Dwight    Dec 6, 04:55 PM    #

6. My mixed-race children ‘look like’ one parent more than the other. So, are they eligible for AA or not? Perhaps we should have a chart of ‘characteristic’ racial features so students can be properly classiifed – 30% white, 27.5% asian,... that’s the logical conclusion to this AA farce.

   — PJ    Dec 6, 05:21 PM    #

7. Dwight makes a good point. However, for those of us on the grad school level, the story is different. The NIH has stated that using economic criterion to admit disadvantaged students, while acceptable for undergrad, is not valid for grad school. Their assumption is that the undergrad experience levels the playing field, and there is no need for preferences after college. Diversity in grad school remains a very difficult nut to crack.

   — Brian    Dec 6, 06:56 PM    #

8. My response to Raymond is a series of questions: 1) Why does any institution have to be “representative?” 2) If “race” or ethnic group is the yardstick for determining
   “representation,” what about those who don’t fit neatly into any of the “race” boxes? 3) How do you square our nation’s professed dedication to equal rights for all individuals, as enunciated in the 14th Amendment and the 1964 Civil Rights Act, with the prevailing practice of treating individuals differently on the basis of their “race,” gender, ethnicity, national origin?

   — Ward Connerly    Dec 6, 09:40 PM    #

9. The lack of diversity that I find most disturbing in grad school – a Ph.D. education program – is intellectual diversity. Many people are too emotionally invested in their political agendas to consider an opposing point of view and objectively debate the merits of their case. Basic assumptions go unexamined and unchallenged. It is more a breeding ground for ideologues rather than independent thinking scholars. It happens to be that faculties are overwhelming liberal, but the same dynamic would take place with a conservative majority. Be proactive in recruiting the best minds regardless of their race or economic status and end the intellectual incest.

   — John    Dec 6, 11:15 PM    #

10. Ward, Dear Fellow: you missed the geometry here. One doesn’t square anything. One makes a circle of it. Like in the circular argument of “damned if you do, damned if you don’t.” As to those who don’t fit neatly into a specific “race box,” you apply the rules of statistics: treat them as outliers, then throw them out from further consideration. It is so neat and simple that even Private McAuslan would figure it out, but. Maybe for that reason Europeans used socio-exonomic criteria for the longest time, and, rathere than wasting time on unnecessary babble, continue to concentrate on enhancing the quality of the incoming and emerging product. Looks as if UoM learned from them how to put the queen to bed.

    — Dag von Lubitz    Dec 6, 11:47 PM    #

11. Dag in comment 10, there are undoubtedly some folks reading this blog to whom it is of the utmost importance what the, ahem, enlightened Europeans do, but there are probably also several who couldn’t care less, and still others of us who on principle would do exactly opposite of what is currently in fashion on the Continent.

    To those of you who clamor for a more socio-economic version of affirmative action, will you still be as supportive if it turns out that the main benefits end up going to lower income whites and Asians? Studies, at least in California, indicate that this is exactly what happens.

    — J. Ward    Dec 7, 12:05 AM    #

12. Ward, I’ll take on your questions. 1. Because if it is not representative, it is probably working in ways that effectively favor one group over another. 2. No matter what criteria you use, you have to draw lines somewhere. I’ve seen it done over and over again with tests like the ACT that predict little but are treated as if they were real measures of abilty or preparation. In the case of trying to help underrepresented groups, you try to focus on groups that are most underrepresented and have experienced the most discrimination. Those that don’t fit in these groups are not excluded, they just are not given a boost to compensate for discrimination, because they have not experienced discrimination of the type that other groups have experienced. 3. In the states that have passed your initiatives, Blacks and Hispanics are given a reduced chance of getting a college education – statistically much below that of whites. Your “color blind” approach only makes sense if the rest of society is color blind – but it isn’t. So I think you need to think seriously about answering your own question.

    — John    Dec 7, 01:58 AM    #

13. Thank you John. I couldn’t have said it any better. I will add this. Although Mr. Ward makes some valid points in his arguments, the end result is the issue. Why send us back to a system we all know didn’t even come close to providing the opportunities we all are deserving of, regardless of ethnic, social, and economic background. If we don’t have a better solution, I would choose the “lesser of both evils.” I truly do wish we could trust everyone to see with “color blind” vision

    — T Anthony    Dec 7, 07:10 AM    #

14. Europe has a worse record of dsicrimination against non-whites than America. It was just not as evident when the numbers were small. And class distinctions…don’t get me started. Then there was the minor problem with the Jews…..

    Not much to learn from the Europeans in this regard.

    — J Edwards    Dec 7, 07:37 AM    #

15. Let me see if I understand this. People are suggesting it’s OK have programs whose aim it is to recruit the best athletes to an academic institution but
    it’s not OK to have programs to identify intellectual “athletes” within certain groups where we know our normal identification methods don’t work very well. Hmmm…..That is an interesting view of what our universities should be doing

    — J Edwards    Dec 7, 07:56 AM    #

16. The fallacies in the attempt to answer Ward Connerly by “John” (No. 12 above) are no less fallacious for being quite common. Taking them in order, his No. 1 assumes, incorrectly, that “underrepresentation” is always and everywhere not only evidence of but proof of discrimination, which is based on an underlying assumption that all groups are equally interested in, qualified for, and available for … everything. No. 2 — “No matter what criteria you use, you have to draw lines somewhere” — is no argument for drawing lines based on race. No. 3 — where race/ethnic preferences are prohibited “Blacks and Hispanics are given a reduced chance of getting a college education” — is simply wrong as a matter of fact. Ending race preferences for minorities may reduce disproportionately (compared to other groups) their chances of admission to the most selective institutions, but clearly not to all institutions. Just as it’s not true that the only options are “Yale or jail,” it is equally true that one can get a fine education in California and Michigan without attending Berkeley, UCLA, or the University of Michigan.

    — John Rosenberg    Dec 7, 08:55 AM    #

17. To Mr. Ward: Considering the fact that a significantly longer period of dealing with “strangers among us,” discrimination, class, and culture allowed Europeans to become, as Mr. Ward justly observes, “enlightened” on these issues, it may be wise to abandon parochial views an become enlightened oneself. Is it not what the discussion is about: assuring enlightenment to those less privileged? To answer the question posed by Mr. Ward: indeed, I will maintain my colour blindness since colour is not the issue. What does matter is allowing all who want, but who have no means, to have full access to high quality education. A walk and talk with youngsters in any slum, be it white, black, brown, stripped or polka dotted, Euro, Asia, Afro, US, or a combination of all, may contribute to further enlightenment of Mr. Ward. I made (and make) such walks frequently, and being contrarywise, do it both in the US, and all over the world. Hence, to hasten the process of said illumination, allow me to state that the universal problem in these places is not the colour of skin that keeps young, often brilliant, men and women from getting education they all deserve: it is MONEY!

    To Mr. Edwards: I think, Mr. Edwards is not quite familiar with the territory, when saying that Europe has “worse record of dsicrimination (sic) against non-whites than America.” He must, most likely, base his emotions on ill-conceived substitution of European attitudes with those of their colonial relatives (which would include Americans, by the way.) As to the Jews? Surely: I never contented the continent whose every stone is soaked in blood represents a panacea worthy of uncritical emulation. What Mr. Edwards failed to note is the fact that lessons from THAT tragic episode of European history alone should help all of us to eliminate the continuation in the US of another one which is not less ugly. Sadly, it doesn’t happen, despite the fact that we all seem to agree that whether based on credo, colour, wealth, or social origin, any discrimination of a human being by another is the most scurrilous sentiment to harbour.

    — Dag von Lubitz    Dec 7, 10:39 AM    #

18. A quick perusal of 20th Century history — see two World Wars, revolutions in Spain and Russia, ethnic cleansing in the former Yugoslavia — puts to the test Mr. Von Lubitz’s supposition that as an older society Europeans are somehow more enlightened than their backwoords cousins here in America.

    — J. Ward    Dec 7, 11:55 AM    #

19. And the re-emerging noose in the US. Mr. Wood? But, do have a look at my comment to Mr. Edwards when you have a moment. Clearly, I am not defending Europe’s gory days. Yet, at the same time note that, thanks to two former adversaries, Messrs. Adenauer and Monnet, Europe finally forgot wars, and started vigorously solving its social problems instead. In the process, underdogs obtained full access to places like Cambridge, Oxford, Uppsala, or Heidelberg, and their parents do not get broke because of that, women are finally close to getting same treatment as men (maybe because Europeams were not afraid of electing women as presidents), all have access to excellent health care (not perfect, but surely not worse than US), and yes, yes, 15,000 died in France during the heat wave of 2003. But French have learned their lessons, and it will not happen there again. Two years after the event, we are still grappling with the devastation, both social and physical, of New Orleans, and when another disaster of similar magnitude strikes, all we shall hear will be another series of lame excuses and mutual blaming. And former Yugoslavia? Go there, talk to people, try to understand the background, and THEN we will discuss the issue. I can assure you, Mr. Wood, that, had the Citizens-of-the Universe-Beyond-the-Next arrived at solutions with the potential to resolve some of my own burning problems, I’d do everything possible to learn, test, and adopt these “foreign” methods in my own world, rather than point out how many wars have they fought in order to reach a sensible conclusion. To learn from history is a wise undertaking; to reinvent the wheel because “it has not been created here” is a little foolish, wouldn’t you agree? But, of late, we’re a bit weak on history in the US, which may explain the problem. Still, let’s abandon this exchange since we stray from the main issue: WHAT ON EARTH DO WE DO with the problem that is serious, will not go away, and may become even worse? We are, after all, dealing with the future of this country, a matter too serious to be subject to further exchange of barbed, and truly superficial, argumentation.

    — Dag von Lubitz    Dec 7, 02:25 PM    #

20. Bravo Dag! The Native American, and Afro-American’s experience of genocide is no less vile than that of the Jews in Europe. The challenge we face is that Ward analysis is ahistorical and does not even account for current discriminatory patterns when it comes to non-whites in the U.S.
    If we allowed for equal access and quality education from kindergarden to College to all citizens; if we could prevent institutions and individuals from denying access to others because of race, ethnicity and gender, we would not even be having this discussion. If the history of the U.S. was not one of systemic and systematic discrimination of non-whites, surely this would be a moot point. I encourage Mr. Ward to read the books when Affirmative Action was White and White Privilege.
    these books would at least provide him with a basic understanding of the structure of privilege in the United States.
    Mo.

    — M St. Louis    Dec 7, 03:08 PM    #

21. Re #7: Brian. Interesting that you bring up graduate school applications. I recently spoke with a college senior who’s applying to 18 graduate schools. He says that departments ask applicants to indicate whether or not they are the first in their families to attend college. Something is happening here and shows that universities are going beyond race and sex inequalities to recognize that social class also shapes educational advantages/disadvantages.

    Re #11: J.Ward The goal of socio-economic/social class equality is widely supported in the United States – especially regarding children born to the lower and working classes. If lower and working class Asians and Whites in California are benefiting from a social class based based AA, then it might behove colleges like Berkeley and UCLA to use some of their abundant resources to do some serious recruiting of highly qualified students in working and lower class Black and Hispanic communities. If colleges say they’re committed to equality of opportunity for all social class groups, then serious recruitment efforts need to be in place and implemented.

    — Dwight    Dec 7, 03:43 PM    #

22. I am late to this conversation but think that the claim that our nation is color-blind is woefully naive. Is there anyone left who is still unaware of racial profiling by law enforcement, or in real estate, or about the disparities in health care that favor whites over Blacks in the USA? The evidence that our society is still struggling with color, along with social class, is abundantly clear to any who will face facts. So, the real question is: how to remedy that. Affirmative Action, as imperfect as it may be, certainly is more benign than the other discrimination based on color that we practice as a nation. So, I agree – it is the lesser of two evils. At least Affirmative Action has the virtue of attempting to bring White and Black together. The usual discrimanation we practice has just the opposite intent and effect. I have yet to see clear and convincing evidence that Whites are truly disadvantaged by Affirmative Action on a level comparable with the disadvantaged experienced by Blacks in this country. Inconvenienced perhaps but not denied educational and economic opportunity, nor deprived of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Again, our usual discriminatory practices have and continue to exact a far higher price on Blacks than anything Whites experience in this nation.

    — Rick    Dec 7, 04:59 PM    #

23. A review of the admissions requirements, as set by the Arizona Board of Regents, available at http://www.azregents.edu/1_the_regents/policymanual/chap2/chapter_ii.htm#2-101 will show that race is not a factor in the undergraduate admissions process. The 3 state universities routinely admit all candidates who present the required credentials.

    — David    Dec 7, 05:36 PM    #

24. Rick,

    Law enforcement uses criminal profiling.

    Banks use economic profiling.

    Disease infects those who do not take care of themselves.

    None of this has to do with “society” or “racism.” If you want to be lawful, I’d suggest not breaking the law. If you want to get a loan, I’d suggest having a steady income and clean credit record. If you want to stay in health, I’d suggest eating healthy food and exercising.

    If blacks don’t do these things, then that’s their problem. (Note that blacks commit 700% more murder per person than whites for example – most of that black on black murder).

    — ACF    Dec 7, 11:23 PM    #

25. Rick and ACF,

    It’s true that Whites – on average – are advantaged and Blacks – on average – are disadvantaged. We must be aware of those averages and develop appropriate social policies. But we should also be aware that not all Whites are privileged. For example, approximately 54 million Whites (or 27-30% of the White population) are in the lower and working classes. These people are not “advantaged” when compared with the middle and upper middle classes. And not all Blacks are disadvantaged. Approximately 16 million Blacks (or 46-48% of the Black population ) are in the upper middle and middle classes. These people are advantaged when compared with the working and lower classes.

    My point is that we also need to take a close look at social class, in addition to race when we talk about Black/White differences, when we utilize/change policies like Affirmative Action to address problems of inequality, and make comments about murder rates.

    I think one of the central questions in the Affirmative Action debate is: Do upper middle and middle class students need the advantage of a race/gender based Affirmative Action.

    — Dwight    Dec 8, 11:47 AM    #

26. ACF – please read The Origins of the Urban Crisis by Thomas Sugrue, (Princeton U Press, 1996) then reconsider your claims about what is needed to avoid entanglement with the law as a Black person(I have personally witnessed law enforcement’s racial profiling without ever having violated a law nor were the persons with me involved in any illegal activity or even suspicious activity, we were just DWB – most recent occurence was Spring 2001), economic opportunity, health care, education, etc. You may want to check on the recent reports (by the AMA I believe) documenting the disparity in health care for Black vs. White cardiac patients – data based on controlled studies making the only differential variable race. I read about a Black real estate agent in Rochester NY, retired law enforcement officer, who was asked by a white client to not be the agent who showed the home for sale to potential white purchasers – that was within the last year. Reason given by the seller – she did not want prospective purchasers to think the home was in a Black neighborhood. Again, I believe one has to be naive or out of touch with the reality of experiences of Black persons in our society to believe our society is color blind.

    Dwight – your points are well-taken and merit consideration in this discussion and in policy formation. Based on my lived experience and academic study over the years, I recognize that race and class often coincide but are not the same for all. Ultimately, I agree with your underlying point – we need to develop more just systems for creating opportunities for everyone to share in the benefits our society produces. Affirmative Action may, flawed though it may be, one of the things we need to do as a society. Maybe it needs to be based on more than just race. I am open to reasonable proposals about how we might, as a society, do that.

    — Rick    Dec 8, 02:53 PM    #

27. My comments/questions are to Ward Connerly (#8) and Rick (#26).

    I was a graduate student in California in the 1970’s when a race/gender-based Affirmative Action was implemented. Social class wasn’t included, because that seemd too extreme and challenged a belief in American individualism (eg everyone should make it on their own). At the time there was broad-based support for AA (both liberals and conservatives), but we all wondered when would it no longer be needed. And what might replace AA, if anything? Even Richard Nixon supported AA in the late 60’s and early 70’s.

    Is the time right for a social class-based Affirmative Action, as a way to address the built-in inequalities in the economy – especially the systematic way in which we underfund K-12 education in working and lower class communities – regardless of race?

    Do upper middle and middle class students still need the advantage of a race/gender-based Affirmative Action?

    — Dwight    Dec 8, 10:57 PM    #

28. Dwight: It sounds like you and I are of the same generation. I completed my masters degree in 1977 (doctorate was later in the mid-80’s).

    I think you hit the nail on the head when you cite the underfunding of K-12 education in working and lower class communities. So, I agree 100% that as a society, we need to correct that inequity.

    With respect to race, however, there is a much more difficult issue. It is much harder to see and address the discrimination and denial of educational opportunity that is color-based when the target is middle/upper class. Consider the matter of the Rochester real estate agent, clearly esconced in the middle class as a retired police officer and a current real estate agent with one of the largest real estate agencies in the Rochester area. That kind of discrimination is a difficult thing to address, and perhaps AA is not the proper tool. But we are not yet a society where skin color does not matter, whether we are talking about students or professionals. And I can’t help but wonder how often that real estate agent’s experience is replicated for students in schools and professional fields but not necessarily discovered in the way the real estate agent’s experience was. Maybe if I saw data that showed that educational opportunity was better distributed than what I currently understand my concerns would be alleviated.

    Perhaps the new generation middle class multi-racial children who are coming of age will resolve this matter in a way different than I can imagine at this moment. Perhaps the model that Barak Obama offers us as a society points to how we might get past the issue of skin color, eventually.

    I appreciate your thoughtful consideration of the matter.

    — Rick    Dec 9, 02:37 PM    #

29. I think the biggest objections African Americans (and hispanics) have to class-based affirmative action is that it is temporary. They like entitlement; benefits that last a lifetime rather than a temporary leg up.

    For example, a child growing up in harlem gets a scholarship and becomes an engineer. Once they get their first engineering job, they’re now middle class. No more affirmative action for them—suddenly they have to compete with asian engineers, white engineers, indian engineers, etc.

    Of course, none of this sounds like the AA crybabies I know. They get affirmitive action when admitted to college, yes. But it doesn’t stop there.

    They susbsequently demand it at every company they work for and at every government agency that employs them. If they start a business, they demand that the government reserve special contracts for them.

    There are “disadvantaged” multi-millionaire minority government contractors all over Washington DC. An odd definition of disadvantaged—but if you ask them I’m sure they have a way of blaming the evil white man for their plight.

    Class-based affirmative action sounds OK—but should only go to the disadvantaged—and also most likely, only to promising kids. But that’s OK.

    Adults are adults. If you’re a lawyer or engineer—or a millionaire “disadvantaged” government contractor—shut up and stop complaining about how the world is putting you down and trampling on you, OK?

    — Test Test    Dec 16, 12:52 AM    #

30. Re #29: A class based affirmative action for college admissions would help to address aspects of social inequality. But that still challenges a meritocracy in the US which says that one’s social position is strictly based on merit and hard work.

    Proabbaly the best solution is equal funding for all public education (K-12) so that working and lower class students don’t have to attend purposefully underfunded schools. This would allow, to the greatest extent possible, a full realization of human potential. Everyone should be happy with this democratic solution, right?

    But there might be a fair amount of opposition to this practical attempt to realize equality based on merit. The middle classes would oppose if it meant any $ taken from their suburban school budgets. (And m-c class parents vote!) Plus m-c parents would worry that there would be even more competition for their children in getting into the elite colleges – from those smart working class kids. Imagine having to attend a lower ranked college like most working class kids have had to do for decades. Besides if too many working and lower class kids went to college there might be a shortage of working class kids to join the volunteer military and then there might be a draft – a great middle class fear indeed!

    Affirmative action, education, politics and the military – they’re all related!

    — Dwight    Dec 18, 10:36 PM    #

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