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Author Topic: Counter candidate  (Read 4499 times)
orange23
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« on: May 04, 2012, 6:30:42 AM »

Hello,

I wonder if there is a concept of “counter candidate”. We have seen people use offers from other universities to bargain with their current department heads/deans.

Is it possible the department head/dean to pull out a counter candidate and ask the faculty to do whatever he/she pleases?
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octoprof
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« Reply #1 on: May 04, 2012, 6:36:31 AM »

In their home dept? Where is the alternate candidate coming from without a search?
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shamu
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« Reply #2 on: May 04, 2012, 7:31:35 AM »

Is it possible the department head/dean to pull out a counter candidate and ask the faculty to do whatever he/she pleases?

I take it you mean: what happens at the home institution? Right? I don't think the faculty are likely to be involved in that, unless it directly impacts them (like taking a lab away or something). There is no interview process at one's home institution. Does that answer the question?
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voxprincipalis
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« Reply #3 on: May 04, 2012, 7:51:22 AM »

Is it possible the department head/dean to pull out a counter candidate and ask the faculty to do whatever he/she pleases?

No.

Did you have any kind of academic socialization at all? On this planet?

VP
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forest_and_the_trees
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« Reply #4 on: May 04, 2012, 8:53:52 AM »

I'm imagining all sorts of possibilities for counter candidates.  But I don't understand the question.
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zharkov
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« Reply #5 on: May 04, 2012, 9:09:41 AM »


I don't quite get the question, either.

But in any search, there is usually a "counter candidate" or two, those who have been interviewed, found to be OK but not first choice, and who may accept an offer if the first choice declines.

From the point of view of the hiring school, and in Getting to Yes language, these counter candidates are the BATNAs, the Best Alternatives To a Negotiated Agreement (with the first choice).  The negotiating power of the first choice is thus limited, to some extent, by the existence of these BATNAs.
 

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macaroon
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« Reply #6 on: May 04, 2012, 9:22:09 AM »

Hello,

I wonder if there is a concept of “counter candidate”. We have seen people use offers from other universities to bargain with their current department heads/deans.

Is it possible the department head/dean to pull out a counter candidate and ask the faculty to do whatever he/she pleases?

I don't think this would be possible until the faculty member resigns or until the faculty member's contract comes up for renewal. 

I know I have a contract, and whether or not it gets renewed depends on a "satisfactory" evaluation at the end of the academic year.  But until that evaluation, I'd have to be fired for cause. 
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scion
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« Reply #7 on: May 04, 2012, 1:15:48 PM »

It only happens for superpowers.
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aandsdean
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« Reply #8 on: May 04, 2012, 1:21:06 PM »

I'm imagining all sorts of possibilities for counter candidates.  But I don't understand the question.

Tile?  Laminate?  Recycled glass?  Corian?  Butcher block?

And don't forget, fit is key.
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ruralguy
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« Reply #9 on: May 04, 2012, 2:01:04 PM »

I don't see why a Dean would need a "counter candidate" in order to tell someome to take a hike.

Generally speaking, most Deans would work their hardest to retain faculty, but I suppose, at some point,
you just have to say "look, this is all we can do. We hope you stay, but we can't go farther than we have already"

Plus, this implies that the Dean or Head would have the autority to just immediately hire someone to replace
the faculty member who was seeking the counter-offer.

That would be highly unusual to say the least. I haven't heard of it, but I suppose if there were
a science fiction story that involved a job search, maybe in that story, you could have a Dean doing this sort of thing.
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madhatter
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« Reply #10 on: May 04, 2012, 2:04:13 PM »

Don't believe them, orange23. The counter candidate is a well-known and well-used tactic throughout academia. At my university, each chair is issued an inflatable candidate that packs down to store neatly in a desk drawer. To deploy, simply remove the protective cap over the CO2 cartridge and pull the trigger. Then, stand back! A competitive but less expensive mylar-film assistant professor will instantly inflate.
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monsterx
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« Reply #11 on: May 04, 2012, 2:14:24 PM »

I suppose what Orange means is that you bring in someone, show them around the department, and hint about how this person could have your job.   Maybe make unfavorable comparison between your uninspired record and lazy attitude, and the brilliant new research agenda, and perfect teaching evalutions of the prospective new candidate.  The candidate can be shown your office, not to meet you, but to check whether there is enough shelving for their books, or if they will have to order more from Supplies.  

The idea is sort of like when GM tells the UAW all about their shiny new Mexican factory all full of workers who earn 1/4 what UAW members do.

Heap scorn on the idea now when it is just floating around as a stupid idea on an internet message board, but if someone from your administration reads this thread, you won't be laughing then.  Sure the idea comes from a misconception of how academic labour markets work, but if your administration is anything like mine, if they hear a stupid idea, then that's what they are going to do, and no force in the universe can stop them - no force, that is, except the next stupid idea down the line, which often crowds out the first.  

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octoprof
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« Reply #12 on: May 04, 2012, 4:32:23 PM »

Heap scorn on the idea now when it is just floating around as a stupid idea on an internet message board, but if someone from your administration reads this thread, you won't be laughing then.  

And we'll all be blaming it on you.

I prefer the inflatable assistant professor idea...
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baleful_regards
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« Reply #13 on: May 04, 2012, 4:36:31 PM »

Heap scorn on the idea now when it is just floating around as a stupid idea on an internet message board, but if someone from your administration reads this thread, you won't be laughing then.  

And we'll all be blaming it on you.

I prefer the inflatable assistant professor idea...

I bet those professors would be able to email students grades immediately following any assignment. Due to its super scanning eyeballs and pentium brain chip which comes standard in each model.
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macaroon
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« Reply #14 on: May 04, 2012, 4:37:00 PM »

Heap scorn on the idea now when it is just floating around as a stupid idea on an internet message board, but if someone from your administration reads this thread, you won't be laughing then.  

And we'll all be blaming it on you.

I prefer the inflatable assistant professor idea...

I should get one of those for my husband for when I'm off doing fieldwork.

Drat, I think I went too far again.
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