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[penultimate24]

Here is what I did one term when frat boys (same frat) were enrolled in large blocks within 3 sections of the same class:

Make different tests and quizzes for all 3 sections.

Student in section 1 of the day: "I didn't get a quiz"
Me knowing they did and knowing they wanted one to take home "SURE! Here you go!"
Next student coming in to later class--FAILED because they used all answers (multiple choice) from 1st version.

Once this happened a few times...to a few students....they wised up that I WISED UP.

Lots of extra work...but worth it if you are committed to honesty and fair grading.

Sometimes new tests/quizzes each term are not enough. Sometimes you need 3-4 versions EVERY time.

[wet_blanket]

When I started teaching, I put all of my old tests on my website just because of this.  It never seemed fair that only certain people had access to all of the old tests.  When I taught my first non-majors science class, I was in for a shock on the first exam.  I printed up 3 extra copies of the exam, but when I passed them out, 12 people were without an exam!  I asked people to check and make sure they didn't have extra copies.  No one would volunteer any.  I didn't let anyone start, had 12 extra copies run off, passed them out...and 6 people still didn't have exams!  At this point, I was pretty mad. 

Wow, that's pretty blatant, and I would agree that those students were involved in cheating.

I still don't agree that test banks are always cases of cheating.  If it's clear that the professor reuses questions and makes any transparent attempt to signal the students are not permitted keep the questions, then yes, it's dishonest.  But if a prof doesn't overtly signal this (for example, by retaining graded exams rather than letting students keep them) then test banks in and of themselves aren't cause for accusations of academic dishonesty.

That statement has already been proven false on this thread.  And the fact that the student government is attempting to create a similar test bank suggests that the Greek system doesn't in fact create an unfair advantage for its members.  Any student, given a large and disciplined enough network, could have created a test bank.

This sounds like it acknowledges that idea that test banks (like those in the Greek system) do give an unfair advantage and creating an open one will allow everyone the same advantage.

Alan

I dunno.  I do see that logic, but I guess I quibble with the word "unfair."  An analogy might be that some students can afford to get a tutor and others can't.  There is differential access that isn't based on merit, but would we really say students can't use their resources - be they financial or their social networks - to be more successful in their studies?  It's an equity issue for sure, but I think a different sense of unfairness comes in to play there.

[cc_alan]

That statement has already been proven false on this thread.  And the fact that the student government is attempting to create a similar test bank suggests that the Greek system doesn't in fact create an unfair advantage for its members.  Any student, given a large and disciplined enough network, could have created a test bank.

This sounds like it acknowledges that idea that test banks (like those in the Greek system) do give an unfair advantage and creating an open one will allow everyone the same advantage.

Alan

I dunno.  I do see that logic, but I guess I quibble with the word "unfair."  An analogy might be that some students can afford to get a tutor and others can't.  There is differential access that isn't based on merit, but would we really say students can't use their resources - be they financial or their social networks - to be more successful in their studies?  It's an equity issue for sure, but I think a different sense of unfairness comes in to play there.

In the previous example, students have access to previous exams *only* because they are in the Greek system and it isn't analogous to getting a tutor. Providing everyone equal access to past exams allows everyone to start with a similar advantage. Hence, no unequal starting advantage (only considering past exam access).

Alan

[kiana]

That statement has already been proven false on this thread.  And the fact that the student government is attempting to create a similar test bank suggests that the Greek system doesn't in fact create an unfair advantage for its members.  Any student, given a large and disciplined enough network, could have created a test bank.

This sounds like it acknowledges that idea that test banks (like those in the Greek system) do give an unfair advantage and creating an open one will allow everyone the same advantage.

Alan

I dunno.  I do see that logic, but I guess I quibble with the word "unfair."  An analogy might be that some students can afford to get a tutor and others can't.  There is differential access that isn't based on merit, but would we really say students can't use their resources - be they financial or their social networks - to be more successful in their studies?  It's an equity issue for sure, but I think a different sense of unfairness comes in to play there.

In the previous example, students have access to previous exams *only* because they are in the Greek system and it isn't analogous to getting a tutor. Providing everyone equal access to past exams allows everyone to start with a similar advantage. Hence, no unequal starting advantage (only considering past exam access).

Alan

Furthermore, making a test bank sort of seems like providing free tutoring for students who can't afford to just hire their own.

[kiana]

That statement has already been proven false on this thread.  And the fact that the student government is attempting to create a similar test bank suggests that the Greek system doesn't in fact create an unfair advantage for its members.  Any student, given a large and disciplined enough network, could have created a test bank.

This sounds like it acknowledges that idea that test banks (like those in the Greek system) do give an unfair advantage and creating an open one will allow everyone the same advantage.

Alan

I dunno.  I do see that logic, but I guess I quibble with the word "unfair."  An analogy might be that some students can afford to get a tutor and others can't.  There is differential access that isn't based on merit, but would we really say students can't use their resources - be they financial or their social networks - to be more successful in their studies?  It's an equity issue for sure, but I think a different sense of unfairness comes in to play there.

In the previous example, students have access to previous exams *only* because they are in the Greek system and it isn't analogous to getting a tutor. Providing everyone equal access to past exams allows everyone to start with a similar advantage. Hence, no unequal starting advantage (only considering past exam access).

Alan

Furthermore, making a test bank sort of seems analagous to providing free tutoring for students who can't afford to just hire their own.

[wet_blanket]

That statement has already been proven false on this thread.  And the fact that the student government is attempting to create a similar test bank suggests that the Greek system doesn't in fact create an unfair advantage for its members.  Any student, given a large and disciplined enough network, could have created a test bank.

This sounds like it acknowledges that idea that test banks (like those in the Greek system) do give an unfair advantage and creating an open one will allow everyone the same advantage.

Alan

I dunno.  I do see that logic, but I guess I quibble with the word "unfair."  An analogy might be that some students can afford to get a tutor and others can't.  There is differential access that isn't based on merit, but would we really say students can't use their resources - be they financial or their social networks - to be more successful in their studies?  It's an equity issue for sure, but I think a different sense of unfairness comes in to play there.

In the previous example, students have access to previous exams *only* because they are in the Greek system and it isn't analogous to getting a tutor. Providing everyone equal access to past exams allows everyone to start with a similar advantage. Hence, no unequal starting advantage (only considering past exam access).

Alan

Furthermore, making a test bank sort of seems like providing free tutoring for students who can't afford to just hire their own.

I agree with Kiana's comment. 

It's not that I think it's a wonderful thing that the Greek systems have test banks.  It's just that Greek organizations aren't the only ones which could do this.  The Dems/Repubs on Campus, Muslim Students Association, or Salsa Club could all do the same thing, as demonstrated by student government getting in on the act in the example upthread.

[kcdavis6274]

Are you tenured? If not, let them worry about it and keep doing YOUR job.

No, and that's exactly why I'm worried. Would you want to be granted tenure by an institution with a reputation of blatant student cheating?

[polly_mer]

Are you tenured? If not, let them worry about it and keep doing YOUR job.

No, and that's exactly why I'm worried. Would you want to be granted tenure by an institution with a reputation of blatant student cheating?

So, move.  If you are at the wrong kind of school, then stop beating your head against the wall and go to the kind of school that has the honor code you want.  They exist.

Stop whining and solve the problem.