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[fedscholar]

I just saw an interesting position that is in cooperative extension, non-tenured. In reviewing the particulars, I noted that it requires an annual review and reappointment. I initially thought it would be 3 years. However, I do see that professors advance through rank over time. Not sure how this would work, and how secure the positions would be, if at all. Three years seems ok, yearly reappointment is, well, scary.

Anyone out there in a land grant extension position (forestry, ag., 4H,etc.)?

Thanks.

[optimisticfungus]

Given that ag funding within the U.S. has been on the decline for awhile, the longevity of a Coop Extension position is a bit tenuous. However, I've found that the stability of these positions depends a lot on the University's commitment to ag programs and the individual state's commitment to ag as a whole.

[mleok]

Fedscholar, is this position a faculty position, or is it some sort of program director kind of position? I ask this because it looks like some cooperative extension programs might draw their faculty from established departments, which seems to be what this Cornell page suggests:

http://www.cce.cornell.edu/learnAbout/Pages/About.aspx

One would really have to see if there is some sort of research scientist/research professor track at the university in question, to see if there actually is an official structure for career advancement.

My knee jerk reaction when I see annual reviews and renewals is that this has much less security than your current federal job, and the annual reviews seem to suggest a more administrative flavor to the job, that would probably not be an improvement over the kind of program building you have been able to manage in your current position.

I guess you need to think long and hard about what you find lacking in your current position, and what the appeal of an academic job is to you, and whether this cooperative extension program even makes sense from that point of view. My suspicion is that it does not.

[fedscholar]

The position(s) I have seen are faculty positions, but non-tenure track. Land grant-based for the most part. I do think there is some degree of exposure to the academic side of things in campus-based extension faculty posts, but the question is whether the daily work demands are such that one cannot pursue any substantive research or teaching. More generally, how much latitude do they have to set their schedule and work agenda. My impression is that extension jobs vary from fairly insecure, soft money positions, to base funded, closely prescribed, strongly applied workloads, to well funded positions that integrate well with the larger university culture and mission and offer considerable latitude to set one's priorities and work hours,etc.

For nontraditional candidates like myself, the leadership, partnership development, and adult education aspects are proven strengths that might crosswalk from other sphere within the environmental field. Such soft skills and experiences are not valued as much in strict tt lines. Also, an extension post at say Cornell, for instance, would likely have less competition than a tt-Ast. Prof. post (if I am wrong, please disabuse me). I see it as a "foot in the door" approach to a land grant academic community, where I remain confident my strengths would quickly become self-evident, but I would clarify that I would not apply to any place/position where I could not see myself doing the core duties with some passion and dedication for at least 3-5 years.

As an aside for the other readers who might be interested in federal jobs,  I will say that government natural resource and science posts tend to offer pretty good security, after a one year probational period. Decent salary and benefits too. That is not to say that reductions in force (RIFs) do not occur. But people tend to get reassigned rather than fired outright. On the other hand, the degree of intellectual freedom in most government posts is quite constrained, and the most autonomous research positions are nearly as competitive as R1 tt positions, so hard to come by. For people who are team player, deal well with tight structure and hierarchy, and don't mind submitting timesheet twice month, the feds are a pretty good option right now.

[aandsdean]

In my state, the land-grant has been closing extension offices right and left to reduce the budget.  I suspect this is true elsewhere as well.  We have hired at least one person (an administrator, not a faculty member) who had been laid off from her job with the extension office.

Be careful, in other words.  I don't think any position of this type is particularly secure right now.

[not_one_of_you]

In my state there are three types of Extension positions with differing requirements/responsibilities/funding.  Extension Specialists generally have PhDs and joint Research/Extension appointments in an academic department and are tenure track.  Some have a teaching component as well.  Extension Educators are masters level prepared, generally county based educators with 100% extension appointments and non TT.  Both specialists and educators are funded by the university.  Extension Assistants are generally located in the counties, bachelor's prepared, nonTT and county funded.  To know about work expectations and funding stability you would need to know how Extension integrates with the larger university in the state you are considering.  PM me if you want additional information.

[fedscholar]

Great comments and cautions. Thanks everyone!

[tee_bee]

In my southeastern state, ag extension is doing pretty well. So, like everything, it depends.

[mleok]

I'm not in this field, so one should take what I say with a grain of salt, but wouldn't the TT vs. NTT status of faculty involved in the coop extension program be a good indication of the university's commitment to the program, and the integration of the program into the broader academic mission of the institution?

[fedscholar]

Pretty good hypothesis. Honestly, I just don't know exactly how they work. I don't want to provide more details than I already have here though.

[mleok]

Pretty good hypothesis. Honestly, I just don't know exactly how they work. I don't want to provide more details than I already have here though.

You don't have to report back, but it's something you should look into. My suspicion is that if there are absolutely no TT faculty involved in the program, then it is by definition poorly integrated into the rest of the university.