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[doctorcat]

Hello All,

I have a question about service, one of the three most important parts of getting tenure. I have read through the forum on this, but can't find concrete examples of service types.

I am interviewing at an R1 soon, and I am practicing questions. I want to be able to say something knowledgeable about "service" or "committee service" but to be honest, I have little knowledge about this.

Here is what I know:
I am aware that I should not suggest something foolish like "Oh I'd like to be on tenure review committees," because that would be controversial and inappropriate.
I am aware that there is service within the department, then within the college and then at the university level.

I am happy to do service - I presume it is part of shared governance, and it helps you to meet people beyond your immediate faculty, region of study, college.... So, when questions about "Where do you see yourself 5 or 10 years from now?" I would like to be able to say something more than x, y, z publication and x, y, z teaching, but also add something about service and the development of my service.

Thanks in advance!

[scampster]

Just say "I'd like to be on the parking committee."

[systeme_d_]

No one expects you to know anything about service yet, and there is no way for you to know what kinds of service would be expected of you at any given institution, so it's actually a good thing that you are where you are.  Stay relatively ignorant for now.  I am perfectly serious.

At most places, and definitely at R1s, new hires are discouraged from undertaking any service whatsoever during the first year, and are slowly eased into uncontroversial committees over a period of several years.  At first, service is likely to be on a departmental committee, like the safety committee, or the undergraduate majors committee, or something light.  Over time, service will increase to more important departmental committees, like the curriculum committee, or a search committee.  Eventually, service will extend beyond the department to the university, and then to the discipline.  If you're on a steering committee for your scholarly association, for example, that's service to the discipline.  But this was just to give you a small clue about the many kinds of opportunities later in your career to do work that will fall under "service."

I understand you want to address this issue, but it is really best that you do not.  You are not ready to, and no one will expect that you will be able to.  Just focus on research and teaching in your interviews.  Take advantage of the fact that you will be protected from service in your first couple of years.  

You can ask, if you really must, how soon service would be expected of a new hire, but I don't think that's a great question.  In my opinon, it's better to stay off the subject altogether.

If you were interviewing with a community college, my advice would be different.

[helpful]

I agree with systeme_d_ with one provisio: you can mention any type of service you have done in graduate school if the SC asks anything about being a good academic citizen.

By the way, when I was a VAP, I served on a service committee. When I got the tenure track job in the same department, I was told that my contributions on that service committee helped me get the job as aftewards some new colleagues told me that they saw how I could contribute in service functions from that limited role I took on that committee when I was VAP.

[filmcam]

I mentioned the annual " Chemistry Fair" held by professors and grad students which draw 500-1000 people each time.

[doctorcat]

Okay! I will happily embrace my ignorance and play it safe - but show a willingness to be of service in years to come.

Thank you!

[scampster]

I actually got totally taken off guard by an R1 search committee that asked what committees I would like to serve on there. That question annoyed me, as how can I answer that well as I don't know the university from the inside? I managed to pull together some vaguely coherent answer regarding any initiatives about increasing retention of women in STEM (as I am a woman in STEM). I didn't get that job though.

[hegemony]

Also, be aware that some underperforming faculty justify their lack of publications by claiming that their oh-so-important service on the parking committee and the grounds committee takes up so much of their time.  And some faculty who don't mean to publish little actually do publish little because they can't manage their time, and their service on the parking committee and the grounds committee takes up all the time they'll let it, and they don't know how to say No to spearheading the new campus-wide parking priorities questionnaire initiative, etc.  And so they never get much else done, and sometimes this mean they don't get tenure...

You don't want the search committee to think in this direction.  And basically, no one with good publications and good teaching will fail to get tenure if they're a little less than ardently thrilled by committees.  So don't bring service up at this stage.  Except maybe some profession-wide service that you might already have a hand in.  "I've been asked to head the Graduate Students' Basketweaving Initiative nationwide..."  Also, sounding enthusiastic about service will just sound naive, and maybe annoying. 

When they ask you where you see yourself in five years, they mean that you should describe the scope of your ambitions ("I hope to expand to look at the cultural implications of all Ruritanian basketweaving, and of course I'll be going for a Basketweavers' Grant, so some archive work during the summer should reveal..."). They don't mean, "I hope to be on the Library Wastebasket Committee, and I'm aiming for the Shiny Door Plaque Committee too, call me crazy, but I'm an ambitious kinda person..."

[litdawg]

This is a question that merits being turned back on the committee. We asked it of our candidates this year, and nearly every one turned it into, "Well, I've served on a few committees as a grad student, but I don't think I have developed specific skills or preferences yet. What are the areas of need within the department that you are hoping will be filled by your new hire?" Since most candidates don't have a good answer for the question, turn it into an opportunity to ask a good question about the hiring department.

[msparticularity]

The other thing you could consider bringing up if the discussion turns in this direction is any service to the profession that you have been involved in--including volunteering at your annual conference, doing planning for grad conferences, assisting a faculty member with manuscript reviews and/or conference submissions, and so on.

[indirectquote]

Not to hijack the thread but, er, is NOT participating much on committees as a grad student (at the department or grad association level) a blow against job candidates?

[hegemony]

Indirectquote, no, it matters not at all.

[barred_owl]

There is abundant good advice in this thread, OP.  Hope you haven't stopped reading.

You need to show a combination of willingness to serve (keeping in mind the rather more important research and teaching aspects of an R1 career), but a certain naivete about that service at the same time.  If you can, linking your research and teaching to certain service activities (e.g., service learning experience) could be a winner.

Committees you might want to be part of, farther down the road:  curriculum (department or institution level), strategic planning or faculty senate (university/campus level), IRB/IACUC (university level, but it depends on your discipline), scholarship awards committees (any level), undergraduate research awards or program committee(s).  There are more, but these are usually the headliners on many campuses, in my experience.  You probably DON'T want to say you'd like to serve on a tenure/promotion committee right off the bat, since you likely won't qualify for that service until after you've achieved tenure yourself.

If you've had ANY connection to these sorts of activities as a grad student, mention that in your interview IF you're asked, but don't go out on a limb and say something like, "I believe I would perfectly positioned to serve on the Faculty Senate because...blah, blah, blah."  Depending on the institution, Faculty Senate could be the LAST place you'd want to spend waste your time or risk your tenure-track career!

So, it occurs to me that maybe you'd want to do a little homework about the R1 at which you'll interview.  If they have a decent website, you might be able to dig down and find a list of all of the committees in which faculty might participate, for one thing.  Faculty Senate and IRB minutes migt be accessible, for instance.  Those could give you a faint "pulse" for how things are going or organized on the campus.

Finally, as someone mentioned upthread, don't forget about community service or service to professional societies!!  Those "count" at many institutions, sometimes equivalently to or more than campus/institution-based service (i.e, if you're the president of, say, the World Wildlife Fund, that will probably carry more weight than being presiding officer at your campus' grade appeals committee).

--Barred_Owl, who received a university-level award for service contributions, approximately 3 years after achieving tenure/promotion

[indirectquote]

Indirectquote, no, it matters not at all.

Phew. Thanks!

[barred_owl]

Indirectquote, no, it matters not at all.

Phew. Thanks!

I beg to differ, politely, hegemony.

There are, in fact, some R1's that are increasingly under pressure to demonstrate (i.e., "bean count") the ways in which their faculty contribute to the academic, professional, and at-large community via service activities.  Anyone who is at an institution up for (or soon to be up for) accreditation review knows this.

In the real world, will the OP's psuedo-oath to service during an interview matter much during his/her future retention review?  Probably not, compared to a stellar record of research and teaching when it comes time for a tenure decision SIX years down the road.  But, I think that complete abandonment of,  claims of ignorance about, or outright dismisssal of the service component of a faculty appointment during an interview, could be fatal to one's job prospects IF questions about service are asked.

Do your homework, OP!  That will be your most reliable source of inspiration/information about what to expect.