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[ranganathan]

PS My course focuses on ethical dilemmas, and I look forward to talking with the students about how the book makes Katniss into a killer in the nicest, most excusable way possible.  Agree 100% with T_F in that regards. 

It starts that way, yes, but she doesn't stop there. Katniss kills a lot in later books... and not always for nice, clean, clear-cut reasons. Look at what she did to Coin. It was the right thing to do... but it was also very coldly calculated on Katniss's part. No wonder Katniss ends up with PTSD.

Yes, I thought that was an interesting change over the course of the three books. By the end, she's killing under much shadier circumstances.  But since for the class we're just reading the first book, I'll focus on how Collins keeps Katniss a sympathetic character by making the killings almost inevitable.  I might also be able to talk a little about the changes in the later books- and how the first book tends to be the most popular, probably because it's the most ethically "easy".

[bioteacher]

What's fascinating to me is that they obviously love the books and are so excited to talk about them- and yet have never given much thought _about_ the book.  They swallowed the story, hook, line and sinker, and are shocked when I broaden the discussion beyond, "Wasn't it cool when..."  I threw out the idea that perhaps the Capitol had rigged the reaping lottery, and one fan kept repeating, "But the book said it was random!"  She was able to get beyond it eventually but the emotional connection she had to the book was an obstacle (and opportunity) I'll have to consider.

This makes me doubly glad I keep touching base with Bioson and asking him how characters felt about different things and why they did what they did. I don't expect him to grasp all of the depth, but I'd like him to see that there is a lot more there than just an adventure story. 

[bioteacher]

Has anyone seen the movie yet? I'm heading out today (I hope tickets are available) to preview it before possibly taking Bioson to see it. Normally, I can tell if a movie is okay for kids by reading websites. This one seems to be getting all sorts of diverse feedback on whether or not a 12 year old can handle it. I'll post my thoughts on the matter later.

[rebelgirl]

Has anyone seen the movie yet? I'm heading out today (I hope tickets are available) to preview it before possibly taking Bioson to see it. Normally, I can tell if a movie is okay for kids by reading websites. This one seems to be getting all sorts of diverse feedback on whether or not a 12 year old can handle it. I'll post my thoughts on the matter later.

Yes!  Filed final grades & went to the opening in our town.  Re: the violence - Bioteacher, I think it's best if you preview it and then decide about Bioson.  They pretty clearly tried to keep it from being excessively graphic - they wanted that PG13 - and I don't think there's more violence than typically shown on TV.  Still, it's teens killing teens, and there are some very rough moments, emotionally (I wept more than once).

I would love to hear from others who've seen the film.  I was riveted all the way through, though I'm ambivalent about how well they adapted it, not sure to what extent I stayed riveted because I know the books and can "see" what's going on inside characters.   I thought the actress who played Katniss was a terrific anchor throughout (they did a great job with the Reaping scene) . . . costumes were great (though Katniss never looks as ragged at home in District 12 as she ought) . . . they did some clever things with exposition, placing key information about things Collins described in the narrative (e.g., tracker jackers) in the mouths of the Hunger Games emcees. . . . the visuals of the Capitol, juxtaposed with Katniss's Appalachia-like District 12, were very effective.  Without giving spoilers, one of the most effective moments was, I think, taken from Catching Fire and inserted into the storyline here - I have to go back to the books to check. 
 
On the down side . . . . the hard edge of hunger in District 12 didn't really come across as viscerally as it needed to, nor did the lush opulence of food resources in the Capitol.  The idea that the winners get a year's food for their district did come across, but it made me think something I never really did when reading the books:  how come ALL the districts don't train tribute volunteers simply for a shot at that?  Another moment made me wonder whether, really, the premise of the books isn't deeply flawed: what better way to stoke a rebellion than to kill people's kids on TV?  As far as characterization goes, I'll be curious to see what others thought of Woody Harrelson's Haymitch (I thought they softened that character considerably) and Lenny Kravitz as Cinna (the focus seems more on his sympathy for Katniss than his subversive genius as a costume designer - the costumes seem intended to speak for themselves).  Gale is diminished here, though they seem to be trying to do some set-up for the second film involving his character. 

I'll be curious to see what others thought about the climactic sequence at the Cornucopia.  I don't want to give spoilers . . .

[bioteacher]

Just got back; I'm still shaking! The tension was conveyed through the entire story and I came out very satisfied. I agree, Rebelgirl, that they did a good job of putting key elements into the narrative so anyone not reading the book is fully informed. I also agree with your assessment of how characters were modified. I loved loved loved Cinna. I also cried when R died.

As far as the training of tributes: I don't think the poor districts had the resources for it. Nor am I sure the premise is flawed. While we are protective of our own kids, many people are not. And the actual risks to parents are diluted by the sheer numbers of kids in the district. I think that the fear of losing a child is lost a bit because life is already so hard and they probably get lost to other factors: working conditions, illness, starvation, etc. Two kids die from each district every year to "ensure" the relative safety of the rest. I can see parents hating it but going along because they feel they have no choice. And if the parents do act out, they probably disappear and leave the kids defenseless.

I thought the violence was very well handled. The impact of death was real but we were spared the gore. That's a balance i can live with. Bioette is far too young for this, but Bioson can handle it.

I thought the finale was well done with minimal horror compared to the book. Thank goodness!

The one thing that they didn't do enough of was Katness playing up her feelings for Peeta. I thought that was understated compared to the book. And if one didn't read the book, I wonder if they'd even catch on to Gale's role in Katness's life. But overall, this movie was a solid adaptation of the book that stayed true to the spirit.

Now I just need to get my hands to stop shaking!

[larryc]

I did not read the books but I hated the movie in a way that I reserve for very few films. The minimal plot was just an excuse to have a bunch of kids running through forest killing each other. How the hell is that entertainment? I have read and watched a lot of science fiction and this was very thinly imagined. The acting was dreadful, especially the lead, who seemed to have had an unfortunate accident involving her face and the Botox factory--she had no expression whatsoever. It was a tiresome excercise in emotional pornography.

[bioteacher]

Larry, did we see the same movie?
It will be interesting to see what Biodad thinks of the movie after seeing it. Like you, he has not read the books.

[westcoastgirl]

Thanks for the reviews. My husband, daughter and her friend are currently seeing it at IMAX. I'm eager to discuss it with them (I don't have the emotional wherewithal to stomach something like that).

[marigolds]

I did not read the books but I hated the movie in a way that I reserve for very few films. The minimal plot was just an excuse to have a bunch of kids running through forest killing each other. How the hell is that entertainment? I have read and watched a lot of science fiction and this was very thinly imagined. The acting was dreadful, especially the lead, who seemed to have had an unfortunate accident involving her face and the Botox factory--she had no expression whatsoever. It was a tiresome excercise in emotional pornography.

I haven't seen the movie nor read the books, but as I've read this thread I've been thinking about how perfect Jennifer Lawrence would be for the part. The character sounds a lot like the fabulous character she played in Winter's Bone, which garnered the 2010 Sundance Grand Jury prize.  It's the story of a young girl growing up in the absolute poverty of an isolated Appalachian community and keeping her family together in the face of overwhelming and terrifying circumstances (drug debt, including family murder, mental illness, etc.) 

She pulled that off beautifully, so I'm very surprised that she didn't shine in this similar story.

[bioteacher]

I think she did a fantastic job in this role, Marigolds. I found her to be spot-on in her performance. Larry and I saw different movies, I think. :-)

[spectacle]

I think she did a fantastic job in this role, Marigolds. I found her to be spot-on in her performance. Larry and I saw different movies, I think. :-)

I loved her in Winter's Bone and was pleased when she was cast as Katniss - I think she is doing a fine job with a seriously difficult role.  I saw it last night in IMAX and enjoyed it.  It's a very faithful, sensible adaptation (which is fine for me, with a text like this).  I will say that the first 30 minutes or so used some annoying cinematography (extremely fast cuts, lots of hand-helds and tight close-ups), but it settled down after the Reaping scene.

The actor who played Peeta grew on me (as he should).  I was impressed with how they managed to downplay the graphic violence to get the PG-13 rating while still driving home the desperation of the Games and life in the outer districts. 

Larry, I'm sorry you didn't enjoy it.  We went with a friend who hadn't read the books and she didn't seem to "get" it as much as we fans did, so I'm wondering if there's going to be consistent difficulty for the crossover audience.

So far the box office has been outstanding - we should hear about the greenlight for book 2 shortly, I'm sure.

[ab_grp]

The discussion on this thread has made for some very interesting reading.  I've finished the three books and am looking forward to seeing the movie.  We watched Winter's Bone last night, and I can definitely see Jennifer Lawrence in the Katniss role.  The two roles do seem similar in some key ways.  I'm still not sure how they managed to get rid of enough gore to satisfy the PG-13 requirements while still conveying the extreme violence at the heart of the story, but the reviews sound excellent so far.

[mended_drum]

I didn't much like the film, but it was, for me, because it tried to be too loyal to the novel resulting in terrible pacing and too many details that seemingly went nowhere.  It think it needed a director more willing to adapt the novel to a different genre.

The novels don't feel derivative to me, but the film didn't give a strong enough evocation of this particular world to make it come distinctively alive.  Especially weak in that regard are the scenes in the capital.

[bioteacher]

Biodad said it was transparent and predictable and now that he has seen the movie, he doesn't need to read the book. (Despite my assertion that the book is MUCH richer).

Bioson, on the other hand, LOVED it.

Interesting that you found the pacing to be off, Mended Drum. I didn't feel that way at all. There were some things I wished they had included, but I understood why they didn't have time for them.

[rebelgirl]

It's very interesting that those who haven't read the books aren't finding the film compelling.  If that turns out to be a trend, maybe those of us who've read the books are reading into what we're seeing--?  I did love the books and kept watching for what they were including, implying, omitting.... 

I didn't find the pacing to be off, though I did wish that there'd been more emphasis on the decadence of life in the Capitol - there's actually a cookbook spinoff based on some of the recipes of dishes Collins dwells on in the books.  Emphasizing how foreign the opulence of the food feels to Katniss would show how resources systematically siphoned out of the districts go to support the same people who cheer when they see teens kill each other.  When I read the books, I kept thinking of some of the arguments made by the Occupy movement re: the 1% and the 99% . . . . obviously the Hunger Games world is far more extreme, but the way that violence becomes a media circus and distracts from structural poverty seems to be something Collins was thinking about. 

Bioteacher, thanks for your comments about why the poorer districts don't rebel - that makes sense: 

As far as the training of tributes: I don't think the poor districts had the resources for it. Nor am I sure the premise is flawed. While we are protective of our own kids, many people are not. And the actual risks to parents are diluted by the sheer numbers of kids in the district. I think that the fear of losing a child is lost a bit because life is already so hard and they probably get lost to other factors: working conditions, illness, starvation, etc. Two kids die from each district every year to "ensure" the relative safety of the rest. I can see parents hating it but going along because they feel they have no choice. And if the parents do act out, they probably disappear and leave the kids defenseless.

What I was reacting to --spoiler alert to those who haven't seen the film yet - was the moment when Katniss holds up that hand signal in tribute to District 11 after laying Rue to rest, followed by the riot of the crowd in District 11 when a man who looks as if he could have been Rue's father erupts in fury and they tear down the screen and amplifiers, leading to President Snow telling the gamesmaster not to let the underdog win.  That part was imported from Catching Fire, but it made sense here.  That moment made me feel a poor reader for not having visualized the public response in the districts - it isn't portrayed till book 2, but still.

I agree that there's so little of Gale that Katniss's emotional dilemma doesn't emerge, but then that was the aspect of the books that appealed to me least.  They have, I read, already green-lighted the 2nd film, and at that point they'll have to pump up Gale's role if they want to set up the political choices Katniss has to make in the final book.  Actually, I read that they are planning a total of 4 films - sorry I don't have a link re: that!