next »

[dr_prephd]

OP, every post you make screams "I don't want to start at the bottom.  I'll do a bit of work, but I want a guarantee that the corner office will be mine in a couple years".  ... Pick something that pays enough to do what you want to do outside of work while doing something for work that you like well enough to go in every day.

Probably one of the wisest forum posts ever. This.

[tinyzombie]

OP, every post you make screams "I don't want to start at the bottom.  I'll do a bit of work, but I want a guarantee that the corner office will be mine in a couple years".  ... Pick something that pays enough to do what you want to do outside of work while doing something for work that you like well enough to go in every day.

Probably one of the wisest forum posts ever. This.

+1,000

[grasshopper]

OP, every post you make screams "I don't want to start at the bottom.  I'll do a bit of work, but I want a guarantee that the corner office will be mine in a couple years".  ... Pick something that pays enough to do what you want to do outside of work while doing something for work that you like well enough to go in every day.

Probably one of the wisest forum posts ever. This.

+1,000

See, I don't really get that. I see a lot of confusion, which is understandable, since the OP is considering something entirely new. But I also see a willingness to put in the grunt work to make her way up the chain - she's talked about taking on internships and doing volunteer work to bolster her skill set. She's been networking to find out how these things are done. None of this screams "I don't want to start at the bottom" to me. 

I don't see any real indication that she's expecting an upper level admin position any time soon.

If I'm wrong, RFD, and you are hoping to become an upper level admin, then what these posters are saying is true: that's not likely to happen in the next few years. These are top admin positions, and most universities have very complex hiring mechanisms for filling them, comparable to faculty positions. They're careers that are built over time.

But, again, I don't get the sense that this is RFD's immediate goal.

I think we have to write this one:

All positions anywhere require someone who wants to do the work, from McDonald's up.

in huge red letters.  OP, an admin job doesn't have to be your dearest heart's dream, but, like all the other jobs we've recommended for you, you will have to serve an apprenticeship and work your way up to the more prestigious, more interesting, better paying jobs that midcareer people have.

You will not start at registrar.  You will start as second assistant registration clerk.  In ten or fifteen years, maybe you will be assistant registrar with your MA.

You will not start as head of student services.  You will start as non-student tutor in the tutoring center and, in five years, perhaps, be assistant head of the tutoring center.

But Polly, just a few days ago, you told her that if she wanted to be registrar or what have you, she should work towards that:

However, OP, you should choose a path because you goshdarn want to be a registrar, a student services person, a fundraiser with the university foundation, head of alumni relations, and the like.

Now you're saying that this is a ridiculous goal, and that wanting something like this is a pie-in-the-sky dream and she should come back down to Earth.

I get the impression that something about the RFD's posts is striking you the wrong way, because you're finding fault with everything she writes, and you seem to be all over the place with your criticisms.

[polly_mer]

See if you can follow this logic, Grasshopper.

The OP started this thread by asking if she could leave a graduate program because she was worried that all that work wouldn't pay off in a job.  She explicitly stated being worried about what people do who aren't in school because she didn't understand that world.

She then said she wanted to do something like arts administration, but was unwilling to go to school to get the training; instead, what she proposed sounded like a little bit of resume-building should result in being a fully paid administrator.  Along the way, we went on a tour of why library school wasn't reasonable because it wouldn't necessarily pay off in a timely manner.  Now, we're being treated to a new gung-ho "Oooh, I could be in higher education administration" without a realistic plan to start in student services as a low ranking staff.

What I keep seeing, and maybe this is a result of the kinds of students with whom I work, is an expectation that finishing a degree will result in a great job immediately when the reality is that a degree means one is eligible for a slightly better office-type job in addition to McDonald's.

My point in agreeing with your last post was that a registrar may not start life with that goal, but someone does have to say, "I'd like to try the kinds of things that are done in the registrar's office", instead of saying, "Damn, I don't want to get a real job.  What can I skate into now with my master's degree that will pay off in a year or so?"  All apprenticeships will take several years, not a couple months, unlike the impression I got from some posts mentioning how people can work their ways up unlike library school (all the librarians I know did work their way up as well as going to school).

That master's degree is worthless as a job credential, but it may be useful in terms of being able to finish a big project as well as all the soft skills one gets with a humanities education.  At no point, though, will the OP get a great job with that degree; at best, she is in a good position to get an entry-level job and work her way up more quickly than someone who doesn't have that kind of training.

[rose_fingered_dawn]

Thanks for the comments, everybody. I want to reiterate that this is all really helpful and that I don't mind criticism, since it gives me a dose of reality. So Polly's reminder about having to start at a bottom rung was apt.

grasshopper's right in that I'm doing some networking, and getting in touch with a lot of people for informational interviews, to figure out what path would be best. I'm trying to meet the people my chair has recommended (who are at the very top since chair is a chair and chair's spouse is a vice-dean), but have also contacted some lower-level people because they will have a more current idea of what the reality is about getting a job. I do know that I have to start somewhere at a very low level, and yes, it does bother me. I don't see that as a bad thing - ultimately I want a job that allows me independence and creativity and pays well, and I want to find a career that I can grow in and that has potential for rising up the ranks, not something I can do just to feed myself and have money for vacations. That's why there is so much confusion, because I can't figure out what will be best and what will I enjoy - it's hard to know after putting all my eggs since I started undergrad into the academia basket. At the same time, I've looked into what options there are to get into a career, like volunteering, and my school is luckily doing really well financially, so there are a lot of RA positions to be had, even in my humanities department, and there are work-study positions in university admin which I'm going to start asking around about. I don't know if I can get one, but at least the possibility exists to get hard resume-building experience. And those are all low-level.

So we'll see where all this leads... And I guess there's always teaching high school, which I did enjoy when I did a school session last term, and am contacting schools right now to see if I can do it again.

I am just waiting for the pieces to fall into place and for it all to stop being hectic and confusing, so I can figure out my extracurric involvement and pay more attention to the task at hand - my classes and qualifying exams. There has been a lot more jumping around and confusion in my head than you all have seen.

Thanks again for the advice people have given.

[marigolds]

Here is an article about following one's passion that made me think of this thread (sorry, links are untenable to do right on my phone):

http://blogs.hbr.org/cs/2012/01/to_find_happiness_forget_about.html#.TyfWbHeG1l0.facebook

[dr_prephd]

Yeah, I'm tending to agree with polly here. I think RFD is willing to do some light volunteering or internshipping while in grad. school, hoping it will pay off and lead to a higher-level, creative, autonomous admin. job. And that's kind-of a big "ha!" especially in the non-profit world, and especially without the right education and experience.

So, okay, the internships are nice. But, if RFD wants one of those creative, fulfilling types of jobs, and lacks both the formal skills and the experiences necessary, she'll have to take a low-wage entry-level job and work her way up. Or, work at McDs while continuing to volunteer for years to gain experience. That's not what I'm seeing a willingness to do (sorry, RFD, if I've misinterpreted your hopes in terms of employment). Either way, she's not likely to have any autonomy, or to earn a nice living wage, anytime soon, and probably not any time in the long-term without sucking it up and working in the box office (or whatever).

My entry-level admin. experience paid about $8 / hour a decade ago. I recently saw an ad for the same position and they're not offering much more now. Of course, a decade later, that entry-level experience is part of why I now have my current position. So, there's that.