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[chronicler9]

My supervisor (which would be a department chair at a normal university/college) just walked into my office yesterday morning and asked me to meet him at HR in 15 minutes. There I was "let go" essentially for "lack of enthusiasm" for my job and not even allowed to return to my office to retrieve my belongings. They will deliver them to me somehow.

Does this seem even legal? No one said I hadn't done my work or given me any warning. Being run like a corporation, we have semi-annual performance reviews for everyone (incl full-time faculty like myself) and my last one was pretty positive (and mentioned a good trajectory).

Is there anything I can do? They are terrified about bad press and trying to get me to sign a document that I wouldn't discuss anything about the school or reasons for termination in exchange for a few months salary. I wonder if I can get them to keep me there for a fixed time (until end of spring) in exchange for my "silence" rather than trying to buy it for a pittance. Not having a job will hurt in my job search for a TT spot too. (I have been publishing like crazy and applying for TT jobs)

This is of course the worst possible timing for an academic in terms of landing a job, it seems petty and gratuitous, and also hurts the program as they now have to scramble to find someone "enthusiastic".

Needless to say, this was quite a shock to me, I was totally blindsided by it.

Does anyone have an suggestions or opinions on the legal angle? I do plan to find a lawyer (don't have one, nor am I experienced in that whole area) to talk this over.



Background about my current (now former) institution:

For the last 3.5 years I have been working at a non-tenure granting "university" that does about 75% of its teaching online. Some of the full time faculty teaches some of the face to face classes, but mostly is responsible for designing curricular materials and managing an army of adjuncts who does the bulk of teaching. This is a year-around corporate type job (only 20 days vacation) with attendance in the office required M-F during regular work hours (9-5'ish). We have no contracts, and no ranks. It's a dysfunctional place with bad morale. This is like a visiting position w/o ending date, but with less security (clearly) or priviledges. I took this job because it was the only thing I could find after my first VAP position ran out. I have been publishing (on my own time like crazy) and trying to leave ever since getting here.

One of the "deans" was let go in a similar fashion.

[zharkov]

In many or most states, "at will" employees can be fired or laid off without notice.  Since the law differs among states, and depends so much on specific circumstances, you'll want to talk to a lawyer who specialized in labor and employment matters.  I'd suggest consulting a lawyer before signing anything.  I'd also suggest that, at a minimum, your lawyer help negotiate favorable recommendation letters from the people in charge of the place.

[infopri]

In many or most states, "at will" employees can be fired or laid off without notice.  Since the law differs among states, and depends so much on specific circumstances, you'll want to talk to a lawyer who specialized in labor and employment matters.  I'd suggest consulting a lawyer before signing anything.  I'd also suggest that, at a minimum, your lawyer help negotiate favorable recommendation letters from the people in charge of the place.

Exactly what I was going to recommend.  Good luck.

[charlesr]

The firing was probably legal.  This happens in the corporate world frequently.  I've been on the receiving end but I was allowed to clean out my desk.  Definitely talk to a lawyer.  I don't think trying to negotiate another semester is a good idea.  They don't want you and it would be awkward for you and your coworkers.  Take the money and run.

[larryc]

But should he press for more money in return for signing the agreement?

[totoro]

My supervisor (which would be a department chair at a normal university/college) just walked into my office yesterday morning and asked me to meet him at HR in 15 minutes. There I was "let go" essentially for "lack of enthusiasm" for my job and not even allowed to return to my office to retrieve my belongings. They will deliver them to me somehow.

Does this seem even legal? No one said I hadn't done my work or given me any warning. Being run like a corporation, we have semi-annual performance reviews for everyone (incl full-time faculty like myself) and my last one was pretty positive (and mentioned a good trajectory).

Is there anything I can do? They are terrified about bad press and trying to get me to sign a document that I wouldn't discuss anything about the school or reasons for termination in exchange for a few months salary. I wonder if I can get them to keep me there for a fixed time (until end of spring) in exchange for my "silence" rather than trying to buy it for a pittance. Not having a job will hurt in my job search for a TT spot too. (I have been publishing like crazy and applying for TT jobs)

This is of course the worst possible timing for an academic in terms of landing a job, it seems petty and gratuitous, and also hurts the program as they now have to scramble to find someone "enthusiastic".

Needless to say, this was quite a shock to me, I was totally blindsided by it.

Does anyone have an suggestions or opinions on the legal angle? I do plan to find a lawyer (don't have one, nor am I experienced in that whole area) to talk this over.



Background about my current (now former) institution:

For the last 3.5 years I have been working at a non-tenure granting "university" that does about 75% of its teaching online. Some of the full time faculty teaches some of the face to face classes, but mostly is responsible for designing curricular materials and managing an army of adjuncts who does the bulk of teaching. This is a year-around corporate type job (only 20 days vacation) with attendance in the office required M-F during regular work hours (9-5'ish). We have no contracts, and no ranks. It's a dysfunctional place with bad morale. This is like a visiting position w/o ending date, but with less security (clearly) or priviledges. I took this job because it was the only thing I could find after my first VAP position ran out. I have been publishing (on my own time like crazy) and trying to leave ever since getting here.

One of the "deans" was let go in a similar fashion.

I'd take the extra money and spend time on scholarship in the meantime. Working for a for profit is a negative in getting a job at a non-profit college.

[pedanterast]

I dunno if I'd sign the agreement or not but I want to point out one thing.  Unless this firing was for cause, the OP will be eligible for unemployment.  So let's just say that is $500 a week.  And, let's say the severance is $10,000.  Again, state laws differ but in general this would make the OP ineligible for unemployment for ($10,000 / $500) = 20 weeks even if the severance is only equal to say 8 weeks' salary.  At least that is the law in my most recent state.  So that is something to consider.

Let me take a wild guess:  this is a for-profit university.  (Totoro assumed it was, while I was composing my post, but the OP did not specifically say that).  I'd be reading the contract first, on my way to the unemployment office, and before deciding whether seeing a lawyer would be productive.  I'd also be thinking about whether I was in a protected class, while evaluating how much leverage I had.

Then the other thing is, there is the financial remedy and then there is the ST and LT effect on the career.  In other words, one must consider the value of STFU when evaluating all of this.

[larryc]

Things you might ask for in return for signing the agreement:

1. More money--double whatever they are offering.

2. A letter of recommendation, that you will write yourself and your boss will sign, on official stationary and submitted to your Interfolio account. (Have the text of the letter and an Interfolio account ready.)

3. A promise that they will not dispute your unemployment claim.

I am surprised that you did not sign a non-disclosure form when you were hired (or did you?) and I'll bet right now they are worried and trying to cover their tracks. I don't think you hav a lot of leverage and you should not overplay your hand, but try to get something more out of the bastards.

[aandsdean]

But should he press for more money in return for signing the agreement?

Yes. If they're offering 3 months' salary for a release of all claims, they are worried about something.

[jackit_n_tyy]

My understanding based on my interactions with our HR dept. and problem employees as a Chair is that, if the termination action does not square with a document trail, including the agreed upon employee evaluations, then the employer has a somewhat weakened position, and could expect legal problems.  Well, at least in NY.

Their actions seem to indicate that you have legal leverage.  As others say, don't sign anything until you talk to a lawyer.

[offthemarket]

Definitely talk to a labor lawyer, ideally one with higher ed experience.  This will give you insight in signing that document. The fact that they want to pay you money and ask you to sign it does say something about a legal leg you might have to stand on.

In the meanwhile, larryc's list for negotiating is excellent, in my relatively uninformed opinion.

In fact, asking for a year's worth of salary might not be a bad idea.

[chronicler9]

In many or most states, "at will" employees can be fired or laid off without notice.  Since the law differs among states, and depends so much on specific circumstances, you'll want to talk to a lawyer who specialized in labor and employment matters.  I'd suggest consulting a lawyer before signing anything.  I'd also suggest that, at a minimum, your lawyer help negotiate favorable recommendation letters from the people in charge of the place.

Sorry for replying/posting this late, needless to say this has left me somewhat reeling from this shock .. to have your livelihood taken from you from one moment to the next w/o any warning is quite a jarring and most surrealistic (nightmarish) experience.

I believe I am in a "at will" state.

Two quick questions come to mind:

1. how do I find a good lawyer who is an expert is labor/employment affairs  - would contacting AAUP for a referral be a good way to go about this? (I've never needed a lawyer in my life before)

2. how can I ensure that favorable letters are sent? Many school I apply for request that the recommender e-mail his/her letter, or the online application system automatically generates an e-mail to the recommender with a link to upload their letter to the school's online application system - how would I know what documents are uploaded?

[chronicler9]

The firing was probably legal.  This happens in the corporate world frequently.  I've been on the receiving end but I was allowed to clean out my desk.  Definitely talk to a lawyer.  I don't think trying to negotiate another semester is a good idea.  They don't want you and it would be awkward for you and your coworkers.  Take the money and run.

Well, this place was/is run like a corporation, the terminology used, policies employed are all corporate. The background of most people is corporate. And within my division I was the only person who had ever taught at a traditional university/college. In fact until about 2 years ago we didn't even have a faculty manual, just an employee manual that applied to everyone working there - be they a faculty, a maintenance person, librarian, admin assistant, etc.

I have not been allowed back into my office, nor will I. Instead HR and my supervisor have been in it and have removed some papers and items (I don't know what since I haven't been allowed back into the building - but I know because a colleague observed this). They also have tagged what presumably belongs to me and a moving company is going to box up my things and deliver them to me.

Yes, after thinking about this yesterday, I think I will take money instead of going back but this will hurt me career wise I believe. Applying for other jobs now as an unemployed academic makes me look less desirable, plus having to explain why I am no longer employed. Also, I am not quite sure how to handle any sorts of publications I might submit to conferences since I won't have an academic affiliation any longer (I'm in the STEM field).

Since I had been applying for TT jobs for next year, I am lucky to have a campus interview lined up for next week. A few days ago when I had my phone interview I was still employed as a faculty member, now I am not and I am not quite 100% sure how to deal with this if it comes up during the campus interview - but that is a different issue which I have raised in a separate thread.

http://chronicle.com/forums/index.php/topic,83666.0.html

[chronicler9]

I'd take the extra money and spend time on scholarship in the meantime. Working for a for profit is a negative in getting a job at a non-profit college.

How would you handle the lack of academic affiliation? Won't that be a problem when trying to submit papers/articles to journals/conferences? Would they be perceived differently by the reviewers/organizers?

I'm in a STEM field.

FWIW, this was a non-profit institution (at least in name), but very much run like a for-profit one, and definitely in the same group and competing with those big name for-profit universities everyone is familiar with for the same student population (mostly working adult).

[chronicler9]

Then the other thing is, there is the financial remedy and then there is the ST and LT effect on the career.  In other words, one must consider the value of STFU when evaluating all of this.

I know what STFU means, and if they are going to try to buy my silence (which they are trying to do by dangling 3 months pay, but w/o insurance or other benefits) any agreement would also have to stipulate that they couldn't say anything damaging about me - but yes, all of this looks bad for me trying to apply elsewhere. So I will probably try to get as much money out of this as I can to help somewhat compensate for this as I try to regroup from this shock.

Clearly by waiting until the current academic year had started to sack me they nixed my chances for a job this year - and this whole situation  will clearly impact my chances for the coming year too - and in the case of my (only) upcoming interview, also put me into a much weaker negotiation position with that institution and possibly force me to accept a job at a pay/benefit lower than I ordinarily would have considered.

Oh, and I just figured out what you meant by ST and LT (short and long term, right?) Yes, that is clearly on my mind too. What will they say if a SC contacts them about me - and if they refuse to say anything "due to legal issues/agreement" - that too will look bad for me I think.

[I don't know much about unemployment and unemployment benefits etc .. I guess something else I will have to learn about as I try to find a lawyer to help me sort all of this out]