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[americaphd]

What is a university lecturer at Cambridge or Oxford? equivalent to lecturer or senior lecturer?
I see from job advertisements that the pay is somewhat similar to that of lecturers, but many people I know who hold such posts in cambridge or oxford are senior academics, which is puzzling...

How realistic is it to survive on a university lecturer's pay? Are there any financial allowances for being a fellow in one of the colleges?
I am trying to figure out the UK system and wish to apply for jobs in the UK.  

[oddlyodd]

Is this a permanent or temporary post, and is it together with a college fellowship? A 'lecturer' on its own without a college fellowship would suggest some sort of temporary post.

Most academics at Oxbridge are fellows of a college, and do the majority of their teaching for colleges. They are usually also employed as lecturers for the university as a whole (in effect having two contracts and two jobs, therefore). Lecturers might give a couple of lectures and classes per week.

Salary for a lecturer would therefore be comparatively low, because most academics would be receiving most of their full salary from the colleges.

[totoro]

I am trying to figure out the UK system and wish to apply for jobs in the UK.  

The system at Oxford and Cambridge is different to that at other UK universities due to the divide between the colleges and the university.

[americaphd]

Thanks for the information. The post is permanent and does mention something about providing supervision at colleges that would be compensated. So can one assume that refers to a college fellow?
And how much does a fellow at colleges typically pay?

[babbinacara]

I am trying to figure out the UK system and wish to apply for jobs in the UK.  

The system at Oxford and Cambridge is different to that at other UK universities due to the divide between the colleges and the university.

And the systems at Oxford and Cambridge are different from each other. Most university lectureships at Oxford come with a college attachment. That is not the case at Cambridge.
There are University Lecturers and College Lecturers, and these may overlap, but not completely. A University Lectureship is effectively a permanent job and that salary would come from the university, whether that person held a College Lectureship in addition or not. That person would teach (and do research and admin) for the university as his/her primary job.
A College Lectureship is not always permanent; that salary would come from a college--this may then be all the total salary someone receives or a part of it, if s/he also has a university post. That person might spend all (if college only) or some (% depending on contracts) time teaching for a college. Research is not a college priority.

A University salary is usually more than a College salary. Then a University Lecturer may teach for a college or colleges, and be paid extra per head (though not all that much) without being a College Lecturer or even a Fellow.
Confused? Welcome to AD 1200.

A University Lecturer salary is just fine to live on, though neither town is cheap.

[americaphd]

And the systems at Oxford and Cambridge are different from each other. Most university lectureships at Oxford come with a college attachment. That is not the case at Cambridge.

It is indeed confusing. Thanks for the information.
In that case, oxford seems to offer a better salary package (with an additional salary of being a college fellow) than cambridge (without college fellowship for most lecturers).
good to know that...do most academics at oxford rent or buy? how does living standard at oxford compare to places in US such as Chicago or Stanford?
  

[seniorscholar]

That is actually two different questions. Are you asking about cost of living (how much of your income does it take to have a comfortable place to live?) or standard of living, i.e., what you define as an appropriate way of life for someone at your career stage? In neither place will you expect (or be able) to afford a single house with a large yard. And in neither place would I (personally) ever bother with having a car: public transportation is too good, and driving/parking too awful, to even consider it.

[drspouse]

The College Lecturer bit pays peanuts, compared to the University Lecturer bit, unless you work many many hours for the College - the only people who survive on the College Lecturer part are similar to adjuncts.

[americaphd]

The College Lecturer bit pays peanuts, compared to the University Lecturer bit, unless you work many many hours for the College - the only people who survive on the College Lecturer part are similar to adjuncts.

do you mean "Fellow" when you say "College Lecturer"? (as you can see, I'm still a little confused...)
Are you saying that there is not much difference in terms of salary between a University Lecturer and someone who is a University Lecturer + Fellow in one of the colleges? But an earlier post seems to suggest that a fellow salary is quite substantial and would supplement the otherwise relatively low pay of the University lecturer?
(Quote: "Salary for a lecturer would therefore be comparatively low, because most academics would be receiving most of their full salary from the colleges")

[seniorscholar]

Is this all theoretical at this point? Why don't you apply for everything you can find, and then, when you have an offer, find out what the pay will add up to and come back with your questions? Why do you need to choose beforehand? Are you in a field so needed, and are you such a star, that you're certain you'll get whatever you apply for?

[totoro]

In my field (economics) you'll definitely be worse off financially - taking cost of living, salary, and taxes into account - working almost anywhere than places like Chicago and Stanford.

[drspouse]

The College Lecturer bit pays peanuts, compared to the University Lecturer bit, unless you work many many hours for the College - the only people who survive on the College Lecturer part are similar to adjuncts.

do you mean "Fellow" when you say "College Lecturer"? (as you can see, I'm still a little confused...)
Are you saying that there is not much difference in terms of salary between a University Lecturer and someone who is a University Lecturer + Fellow in one of the colleges? But an earlier post seems to suggest that a fellow salary is quite substantial and would supplement the otherwise relatively low pay of the University lecturer?
(Quote: "Salary for a lecturer would therefore be comparatively low, because most academics would be receiving most of their full salary from the colleges")

I don't know how much the Fellow would pay but a College Lecturer is usually either nearly-full-time teaching adding up to a relatively low salary, or a few hours of teaching at an hourly rate. They are different positions. A lecturer teaches (and squeezes in a little research if they are lucky/motivated) while a Fellow is a proper academic and is paid for both teaching and lecturing.

[babbinacara]

The College Lecturer bit pays peanuts, compared to the University Lecturer bit, unless you work many many hours for the College - the only people who survive on the College Lecturer part are similar to adjuncts.

do you mean "Fellow" when you say "College Lecturer"? (as you can see, I'm still a little confused...)
Are you saying that there is not much difference in terms of salary between a University Lecturer and someone who is a University Lecturer + Fellow in one of the colleges? But an earlier post seems to suggest that a fellow salary is quite substantial and would supplement the otherwise relatively low pay of the University lecturer?
(Quote: "Salary for a lecturer would therefore be comparatively low, because most academics would be receiving most of their full salary from the colleges")

Chime with Seniorscholar. The potential variability in rights, obligations and salary even within one institution is enormous. Read the adverts; that is the only place you will find accurate info on salary and teaching load and position. Apply. Assess the very varied packages you might be offered. Then, only when and if you are actually faced with this amazing, improbable and difficult choice, decide.

[scotia]

But an earlier post seems to suggest that a fellow salary is quite substantial and would supplement the otherwise relatively low pay of the University lecturer?
(Quote: "Salary for a lecturer would therefore be comparatively low, because most academics would be receiving most of their full salary from the colleges")

I think that this is wrong - the University Lectureship usually, if not always, pays more than a fellow's salary.

[wegie]

But an earlier post seems to suggest that a fellow salary is quite substantial and would supplement the otherwise relatively low pay of the University lecturer?
(Quote: "Salary for a lecturer would therefore be comparatively low, because most academics would be receiving most of their full salary from the colleges")

I think that this is wrong - the University Lectureship usually, if not always, pays more than a fellow's salary.

That would usually be the case at Oxford. University Lectureships pay somewhere around the usual starting point for a lectureship (about £35/36K at the moment) and the college portion will bump this to around £43K.Then there's the housing allowance and meals to think about as well. At Oxford, unless one is on the clinical track, it's rare to find a University Lectureship that doesn't come with a fellowship. Departmental Lectureships, on the other hand, don't come with official college affiliations and the pay is worse than that of a University Lectureship -- which is one reason why the departmental lecturers in my last department had a nasty tendency to be poached by my alma mater two years into their contract. As for the rest of the mishmash of stipendiary lectureships, tutorships, fellowships, and memberships of common rooms -- well, WH and I between us have something like 15 years at the place and we still scratch our heads.