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News: Talk about how to cope with chronic illness, disability, and other health issues in the academic workplace.
 
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Author Topic: a lifetime investment in our students  (Read 10149 times)
theblondeassassin
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« Reply #15 on: September 26, 2011, 03:45:20 PM »

Dear blonde, if you are not interested in thinking, there is not need to get involved in the discussion. Is there such a thing as like non-empirical evidence?

I'm not angry and negative, I'm mildly sarcastic and pragmatic.

If you're really interested in the implications of a switch from lump-sum tuition to a direct (or indirect) graduate-tax, consider the empirical evidence available rather than trying to conduct vague thought-experiments.

Dude, I not only have significant responsibilities in my own university that include policy-making on tuition and fees, I teach in the area of higher education entrepreneurship to students who include the heads of universities from four continents, including those who've started up universities ab initio.

Do you think that I might know something about the topic, or that the other posters who've responded to you might as well?
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polly_mer
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« Reply #16 on: September 26, 2011, 06:03:55 PM »

Do you think that I might know something about the topic, or that the other posters who've responded to you might as well?

I'll bet folding money that the answer is No.

Say, Pete, if pyramid schemes are such a great idea, why are they illegal?  (hint: people who aren't a handful of the lucky few who got in early lose their shirts).

As Prof_Smartypants asked, what problem are you trying to solve by making a hugely complicated system that will be difficult to administer?  As a side note, do you know what percentage of the funds raised by the IRS are spent on the bureaucracy of the IRS?  Your scheme is even more complicated since employers are not required to submit the necessary paperwork to each college.

Oh, and I attended three schools during my education.  Must I really pay all of them or just the one where I learned the most that is the most relevant to my current job? 
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If you haven't got either the anatomical or metaphorical balls to post your own question on a pseudonymous internet forum, then academia is the wrong job for you.
voxprincipalis
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« Reply #17 on: September 26, 2011, 07:33:13 PM »

What if you change careers?

What if you win the lottery?

What if you get a bachelor's in engineering because it's what Mom and Dad want you to do but you hate it and you never work in engineering and instead you become a novelist and write four best-selling books and then drink yourself into bankruptcy?

What if you get an international studies degree, go into politics, become a lobbyist, and then get fired for sleeping with a staffer?

What if you go on to a PhD program and can't get a TT job in academia?

What if you become a stay-at-home mom/dad?

What if you start your own business in a field unrelated to your actual degree?

What kinds of careers "count" if, say, you have a degree in Philosophy?

If you take your Astronomy degree and become a high school science teacher, is that worth more or less than working for NASA? It pays less, presumably, but oh, isn't it worth so much more to the children of tomorrow?

If you take your business degree and earn millions of dollars annually off of sweatshops and illegal/unethical labor practices, does that still count?

If you supplement your income with meth trafficking, do we count only the income from the job that gives you a W-2, or do we get a cut of the meth-based income as well, since presumably your business understanding gained in college helped you to make that a successful enterprise?

What happens to students who drop out but still go on to careers in the field they were studying (or, in some other field; we might assume they'd have changed their major had they stayed in school) -- do we get some sort of pro-rated cut of their salary?

What about the students who are on athletics scholarships -- do we get a cut of their NBA/NFL salaries? Or do only the coaches get that money?

What happens if students go out and get good jobs but get downsized due to economic conditions? Surely that isn't our fault. Or is it?

Oh, and let's not forget this tiny but centrally important point: I am not responsible for what happens to my students outside their academic life. After they graduate, they are on their own. Even while they are in school, I do not act in loco parentis. They are their own people. They are adults. They are responsible for themselves. How many students, exactly, am I supposed to feel a personal responsibility for? Let us say that I teach 100 students a year. In 30 years of teaching, that's 3,000 individual students. I can't even afford the postage to send them all a Christmas letter.

VP
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If you need me, I'll be hiding under a rock until mid-August. Try not to need me, unless you come bearing Chinese food.
merinoblue
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« Reply #18 on: September 26, 2011, 07:35:06 PM »

What if you go on to a PhD program and can't get a TT job in academia?

That would never happen.
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hipgeek
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« Reply #19 on: September 27, 2011, 06:16:52 AM »

What if you go on to a PhD program and can't get a TT job in academia?

That would never happen.

Duh. 

Didn't you see the pictures of the happy graduates walking right into private, wood-paneled offices at ivy league schools that the OP had featured in his pyramid scheme innovative higher education reform brochure?
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I have no tolerance for swinish behavior, except from actual swine.
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