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Author Topic: My summer online students are braindead  (Read 7249 times)
mimi1
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« Reply #15 on: June 22, 2011, 07:24:13 PM »

After the first threaded discussion, I immediately give every student detailed feedback.  I do use a rubric, but I also offer detailed suggestions and comments so they can (hopefully) improve on the next discussion.  Part of my rubric states that if another student or I pose a question, they will get points taken off if they do not respond to that question in the discussion.  This way, I can dig a little deeper.  It takes work at the beginning of the semester, but if a class gets off to a good start on the threads it generally seems to do better overall, at least in my experience.
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alleyoxenfree
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« Reply #16 on: June 22, 2011, 07:52:07 PM »

Quote
#2 -- I haven't done this in the syllabus, but I've tried to do it in my interventions into the discussions.  They either ignore it or don't know what I'm on about.

#3 -- Yes, I think this is the only thing that will make them sit up and take notice.  The grades for this class are going to be way low.  Problem is this is punishing after the fact (it's just too much work, with 20 students, to grade participation on a weekly basis).  I think your #2 suggestion about the syllabus may help next time.  Maybe I need to lay out a clear rubric for the quality of participation I'm expecting. IT's not just how many times you post; it's how much you are trying to engage with the text and the topics under discussion. 

I have done #2 and it helps keep the quality high(er) from the start.   In particular I make it clear that a basic plot summary or a simple "agree/disagree" will result in zero credit.   I also encourage them to send me drafts of their posts via email for feedback before a grade the first week (few actually do it but the offer shuts up the whiners later).   I have to take issue with no weekly participation scores.   I do daily participation scores for my summer online class and it isn't terribly time consuming.   I'm usually able to grade 35 posts during daily office hours on a very simple 3-point rubric (which is what is laid out in the syllabus).  The kids who don't check their grades right away get pissy about it, but on the whole they appreciate being able to make changes and improve day-to-day instead of being "punished after the fact" on participation, as you point out.

Would you share your 3-point rubric?
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snowbound
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« Reply #17 on: June 23, 2011, 08:19:27 AM »

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Would you share your 3-point rubric?

Yes, please
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infopri
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« Reply #18 on: June 23, 2011, 01:55:17 PM »

Quote
Would you share your 3-point rubric?

Yes, please

I have a five-point rubric, although I usually use only three of the values.  (Scores of 1 or 5 are quite rare.)  I use this rubric for each and every student post on the discussion boards.  Here's how it works:

1 point = "Me too" post (e.g., anything that in essence says, "I (dis)agree with what Tom said" without elaboration.  Essentially, this post gets a point to recognize that the student did the very bare minimum, by posting, but that the post was wholly inadequate.  (The syllabus specifically disallows "me too" posts, so I don't get too many in this category.)

2 points = The post elaborates or expounds, but doesn't really add anything new to the discussion.  That is, the student has said more than "me too," but the elaboration is, at its core, a rehash or states the very obvious or repeats things directly from the lecture or readings, etc.--and does not even do that very well.  This student may be trying harder than than the one-point student, but a two-point post is still substandard.

3 points = This is an average post.  The student has something to say and says it, but without anything "extra" to deserve more than the baseline of 3 points.

4 points = This is a good post that goes the extra mile.  This post brings in outside reading, for example.  (As part of their workload, my students are supposed to (a) explore a wide variety of websites, some that I point them toward and others that they find themselves, and (b) keep abreast of late-breaking news, which often has a bearing on the topics under discussion.)  Alternatively (or in addition), the post provides a level of analysis beyond mere presentation of fact or opinion, tying together or contrasting different perspectives or adding original thought in some other way.

5 points =  This is an excellent post, one as good as or better than one I could have written.  It has a thorough and sensible analysis, brings in outside points, ties together or contrasts perspectives, and/or in some other way stands out as something a professional could have written.  These are rare, but there have been a few posts that qualified.

So, using this rubric, I grade every single post.  (I usually go through all the new posts once or twice a week.)  In my gradebook (via Excel), I have a column for each discussion thread.  Within the cell for, say, John Doe (row representing the student) and "Government Basketweaving" (column representing discussion thread), I'll have a formula, with each element representing a post.  So, if John Doe posted three times on this thread, that cell will look something like this (the initial equals sign is an Excel requirement for formulas): =4+2+3 and the total, of course, for that thread, will be 9.  Then I do the same thing for John Doe in the next column, which might be "Private Basketweaving."  There, John's scores are =3+1 for two posts (perhaps John had less to say on this thread), for a total of 4.  At the end of the semester, I (rather, Excel) adds up the 9 plus the 4 plus the totals of all the other discussion columns, for a semester total of, say, 42.  I then use a linear transformation to turn the 42 into a number that I can use in the calculation of the final course grade.
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alleyoxenfree
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« Reply #19 on: June 23, 2011, 06:26:42 PM »

Thanks for posting this.  I'm rigorously NOT thinking about such things now, but in August, it will come in handy.
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burnie
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« Reply #20 on: June 24, 2011, 12:02:23 PM »

3 - completely answers the prompt.  Raises a new thought or question.  Specifically references the text (providing page numbers), but is limited in direct quotation.  Meets length requirements (direct quotations do not count toward total word count). Provides one outside, academic source (from approved database) to support or enhance new thought or idea.   Proper spelling, grammar, punctuation.

2 - sets up an interesting new argument but does not dig into the material or draw conclusions.  Vaguely references The text (no specific concept, moment or page numbers provided) OR over utilizes direct quotation with little original argument. Meets 85% of length requirements (quotations don't count).  Provides outside source, but it is not from the approved database and/or it is not incorporated into the argument as support. Several spelling, grammar, punctuation mistakes

1 - is about the prompt but adds nothing new.   Does not reference the text.  Meets less than 85% of the length requirements.  Does not provide an outside source. Grammar errors make comprehension difficult - ANY evidence of blog slang or text speak.

0 - does not address the prompt.  Is so short or indecipherable that it isn't worth responding to.  Is more than 5 minutes late. 


Sounds like a lot, but it makes grading fast, because it is possible to glance and know which #it meet.  A post must  meet all criteria to get a 3.  One issue will drop the score
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burnie
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« Reply #21 on: June 24, 2011, 12:05:07 PM »

I forgot to add that they also have to write three substantive replies to their classmates' posts.   They are worth one point each - either they add to the discussion or they don't, and basic agree/disagree replies add nothing. 
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Corporate America wants people who seem like bold risk takers, but never actually do anything.  - Barney Stinson
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