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[educator1]

A friend of mine said that she got higher evals when she actively tried to be mean.  She speculated that the students were reading mean=authority.  Any thoughts?

I wouldn't say that I try to be mean, but I have found that, when I established a fair set of rules and stuck to them with NO exceptions, students not only gave me higher evals, but the classroom atmosphere was more positive and friendly. My students expressed enjoyment of the class and my enjoyment of teaching went up dramatically.
I think that students try to intimidate those that they percieve as vunerable and don't try it if they perceive a low probability of success.

[lerasmus]

I think that students try to intimidate those that they percieve as vunerable and don't try it if they perceive a low probability of success.

Yes, yes, yes!

[fiona]

I think that students try to intimidate those that they percieve as vunerable and don't try it if they perceive a low probability of success.

Yes, yes, yes!

Students, in short, are rather like rabid dogs? Well, maybe.

The Fiona

[spork]

My wife has to deal with this every semester.  There's always at least one male student who doesn't do the assignments, tries to cop a Mr. Charming attitude when he does attend class, then becomes spiteful and aggressive at the end of the semester when he realizes his behavior hasn't worked.

[prufrock]

I commented to X that the draft of the university's report on publication included virtually nothing from X's huge department. X emailed the chair, who forwarded the email to the department.  X then received an email from Y, asking X to check to see if the latest edition of Y's book appeared on the report and if not to email the particulars to the person compiling the draft.  X is a tenured associate professor.  Y is a long-time lecturer.  Anyone care to make a guess about X's and Y's ages and genders?

[fiona]

My wife has to deal with this every semester.  There's always at least one male student who doesn't do the assignments, tries to cop a Mr. Charming attitude when he does attend class, then becomes spiteful and aggressive at the end of the semester when he realizes his behavior hasn't worked.

Yes, this is a chronic syndrome, esp. among frat boys.

The Fiona

[onion]

My wife has to deal with this every semester.  There's always at least one male student who doesn't do the assignments, tries to cop a Mr. Charming attitude when he does attend class, then becomes spiteful and aggressive at the end of the semester when he realizes his behavior hasn't worked.

Yes, this is a chronic syndrome, esp. among frat boys.

The Fiona

I had to have this student physically removed from my office today.  It's not the first time I've encountered such behavior.  I think it's because I'm young, female, and also short.  I'm not kidding about the short part--I think it plays a role in their attempts to intimidate. 

[edwidge]

Sounds scary, Onion!

Yes, I have some vague recollection of reading somewhere that height is positively associated with authority. I am almost six feet tall (and usually wear boots with two-inch heels to teach), and I do think it makes a difference.

Generally speaking, after teaching for seven years, I find that I am much less likely to offer an explanation for my decisions (e.g., student asks "Do you put your lectures online?" I say "No." vs. a lengthy explanation about how studies show that learning blah blah blah), though I am not autocratic. I feel much more authoritative than I used to, and I don't mind being perceived as intimidating. I'm not their friend and have no personal or emotional investment in whether or not they do the reading, blow off class, etc. Probably also helps that I am in my early 40s now; as I age I think I become less of a target, especially for male students.

[lerasmus]

I feel much more authoritative than I used to, and I don't mind being perceived as intimidating. I'm not their friend and have no personal or emotional investment in whether or not they do the reading, blow off class, etc.

If teacher training programs in grad school actually put some effort into teaching this (or even mentioning that it's something new teachers should practice), I think many fewer teachers would go through an extended phase of being attacked by their students. Great advice. I kind of figured out the "I'm neither your friend nor have any personal investment" bit through trial and error, but used to have many confrontational students before and now have none.

[fiona]

I feel much more authoritative than I used to, and I don't mind being perceived as intimidating. I'm not their friend and have no personal or emotional investment in whether or not they do the reading, blow off class, etc.

If teacher training programs in grad school actually put some effort into teaching this (or even mentioning that it's something new teachers should practice), I think many fewer teachers would go through an extended phase of being attacked by their students. Great advice. I kind of figured out the "I'm neither your friend nor have any personal investment" bit through trial and error, but used to have many confrontational students before and now have none.

These fora do a lot of the work that teacher training should do. Grad students should be directed to reading the advice here.

The Fiona

[onion]

I feel much more authoritative than I used to, and I don't mind being perceived as intimidating. I'm not their friend and have no personal or emotional investment in whether or not they do the reading, blow off class, etc.

If teacher training programs in grad school actually put some effort into teaching this (or even mentioning that it's something new teachers should practice), I think many fewer teachers would go through an extended phase of being attacked by their students. Great advice. I kind of figured out the "I'm neither your friend nor have any personal investment" bit through trial and error, but used to have many confrontational students before and now have none.

Not for nothing, but this does kind of turn it around on those of us who are targets for threats and intimidation.
I may be short and a woman, but I'm not a pushover.  I had fantastic pedagogical training in grad school, and I've been  teaching for over a decade.  And yet, every semester there's some big dude who stands over my desk and screams obscenities at me, the preferred insult being "that's bulls***, you b*tch."  This usually comes in response to "no, I won't overlook your 16 absences" or "yes, the plagiarism and academic honesty policy applies even to you."   The students' perceptions of gender and power lead them to conclude that I am an "appropriate" target--that I can't retaliate, that no one will back me up, that I will back down.   I also attribute the perception that I'm a "teacher" and not a "professor" to their understandings of gender and authority.  Today after the student was hauled out of my office, I asked my office neighbor how many times in his career he's had to have a student physically removed from his office.  In 25 years of teaching, never.  Me? About once a year. 

I do hope that the students eventually get a clue.  What's going to happen when they have a woman as a boss?

[embitteredhistorian]

I feel much more authoritative than I used to, and I don't mind being perceived as intimidating. I'm not their friend and have no personal or emotional investment in whether or not they do the reading, blow off class, etc.

If teacher training programs in grad school actually put some effort into teaching this (or even mentioning that it's something new teachers should practice), I think many fewer teachers would go through an extended phase of being attacked by their students. Great advice. I kind of figured out the "I'm neither your friend nor have any personal investment" bit through trial and error, but used to have many confrontational students before and now have none.

These fora do a lot of the work that teacher training should do. Grad students should be directed to reading the advice here.

The Fiona

The teacher training I've endured has taught quite the opposite--we should be emotionally invested in our students' efforts. If we don't care, we're bad teachers, etc. I, for one, learned a lot from professors who didn't give a crap about me--but they did know their field like the back of their hand.

I think the "customer is always right" ethos being pushed on academics is giving students more leverage to act spoiled.

[embitteredhistorian]

I feel much more authoritative than I used to, and I don't mind being perceived as intimidating. I'm not their friend and have no personal or emotional investment in whether or not they do the reading, blow off class, etc.

If teacher training programs in grad school actually put some effort into teaching this (or even mentioning that it's something new teachers should practice), I think many fewer teachers would go through an extended phase of being attacked by their students. Great advice. I kind of figured out the "I'm neither your friend nor have any personal investment" bit through trial and error, but used to have many confrontational students before and now have none.

Not for nothing, but this does kind of turn it around on those of us who are targets for threats and intimidation.
I may be short and a woman, but I'm not a pushover.  I had fantastic pedagogical training in grad school, and I've been  teaching for over a decade.  And yet, every semester there's some big dude who stands over my desk and screams obscenities at me, the preferred insult being "that's bulls***, you b*tch."  This usually comes in response to "no, I won't overlook your 16 absences" or "yes, the plagiarism and academic honesty policy applies even to you."   The students' perceptions of gender and power lead them to conclude that I am an "appropriate" target--that I can't retaliate, that no one will back me up, that I will back down.   I also attribute the perception that I'm a "teacher" and not a "professor" to their understandings of gender and authority.  Today after the student was hauled out of my office, I asked my office neighbor how many times in his career he's had to have a student physically removed from his office.  In 25 years of teaching, never.  Me? About once a year. 

I do hope that the students eventually get a clue.  What's going to happen when they have a woman as a boss?

I'm dying of curiosity to know where you teach. I can't imagine a student anywhere acting that way--but, then, again, I'm male.

[onion]

I feel much more authoritative than I used to, and I don't mind being perceived as intimidating. I'm not their friend and have no personal or emotional investment in whether or not they do the reading, blow off class, etc.

If teacher training programs in grad school actually put some effort into teaching this (or even mentioning that it's something new teachers should practice), I think many fewer teachers would go through an extended phase of being attacked by their students. Great advice. I kind of figured out the "I'm neither your friend nor have any personal investment" bit through trial and error, but used to have many confrontational students before and now have none.

Not for nothing, but this does kind of turn it around on those of us who are targets for threats and intimidation.
I may be short and a woman, but I'm not a pushover.  I had fantastic pedagogical training in grad school, and I've been  teaching for over a decade.  And yet, every semester there's some big dude who stands over my desk and screams obscenities at me, the preferred insult being "that's bulls***, you b*tch."  This usually comes in response to "no, I won't overlook your 16 absences" or "yes, the plagiarism and academic honesty policy applies even to you."   The students' perceptions of gender and power lead them to conclude that I am an "appropriate" target--that I can't retaliate, that no one will back me up, that I will back down.   I also attribute the perception that I'm a "teacher" and not a "professor" to their understandings of gender and authority.  Today after the student was hauled out of my office, I asked my office neighbor how many times in his career he's had to have a student physically removed from his office.  In 25 years of teaching, never.  Me? About once a year. 

I do hope that the students eventually get a clue.  What's going to happen when they have a woman as a boss?

I'm dying of curiosity to know where you teach. I can't imagine a student anywhere acting that way--but, then, again, I'm male.

I've taught at 5 universities, and it's happened at all of them.  I teach a huge gen ed class that everyone "needs" to graduate, and everyone waits until their last semester to take it.  It's a recipe for disaster.

[fiona]

When I taught large lecture classes, I had experiences similar to Onion's.

Men have no idea how strong the feeling of entitlement is among some young males. Men don't see how the frat boy types (and others) move in on our space, stand over our desks, stand over us (especially if we're short), and call names. I guess we're some kind of combination of the powerful mom and the withholding girlfriend, and we're unworthy of the respect that the male lecturer gets automatically.

The last student who called me a "b1tch" did it in an e-mail, which I forwarded to the Dean of Students, and the student was dropped from my class. But usually it's not that simple.

I'm so glad not to be teaching those big lecture courses anymore. I can be a human instead of a lion tamer.

The Fiona