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[post_functional]

It was my first week teaching in a new job.  Part of my method to ensure that the same five students don't do all the heavy lifting is to call on people randomly and employ the socratic method, talk them through their difficulties, etc.  Usually, it's effective.  But one of my students saw me privately after class, told me that in anticipation of being called upon, he/she had to go to the bathroom and had a panic attack (I did remember him/her leaving, I just thought it was an ordinary bathroom break).  He/she asked if I could refrain from calling upon him/her in the future, and instead could just volunteer answers.  It was also said that a letter from a psychiatrist proving a panic disorder could be obtained.

I said that I was sympathetic, and thought that if he/she needs special consideration, to keep everything on the up and up, then I would need a letter from disability services establishing the panic disorder and the direction to exclude the student from this classroom method.  This seemed completely reasonable to the student (thank god), and I confirmed with my chair that this was indeed the correct policy, and it was.

I did everything correctly by the book.  But I still feel so guilty.  Because I have had panic attacks myself (I did not volunteer this to the student; I just want to keep those lines in the sand firmly established) I understand how terrible it is, and I feel so awful that I did something to cause this reaction.  I was also assured by the chair that this is a good student and I did the right thing and all that, and that I should not consider altering my classroom style either, as the chair also happens to think this is an effective teaching style on the whole.

This happened to me once before, too, when I was teaching grades 6-12.  One of my students was going home binging and purging after school because of the anxiety she was experiencing in my purposefully rigorous class.  (This was an academically stringent charter school and I was hired to teach a highly theoretical music theory class, if you'll pardon the redundancy.  None of this "every good boy does fine" stuff; solid first principles only.)  Again, this was a case where nobody knew until after the fact, and the student was given an IIP, and there was no problem afterward.  But when I was first told this, I went home and cried.  I felt really terrible.

Has this ever happened to anybody?  That you yourself inadvertently caused the same kind of obstacles that you go through yourself?

Moderator: I realize this probably could be moved to "In the Classroom," but I would rather have feedback from people who themselves have had panic attacks, depression, and other disabilities rather than the general fora populace.

[oseph]

I've had panic attacks.  While they were triggered by certain situations, they were about me, not about anybody else.  Me.  My nervous system.  My fear.  My uncertainty.  My identity.  My crazy brain.  Yes, often my adviser had something to do with it - I remember once in a seminar led by my adviser, I had been tapped to go out to dinner with the guest speaker afterwards - a big honor.  I was so worried that I wouldn't be able to keep the dinner conversation going that I broke out in hives during the seminar and had to beg off the dinner (and run to the pharmacy for Benadryl).  The important thing is that this was about ME - in no way did I fixate on my adviser as the source of the panic attacks.  I had to learn coping mechanisms over the years, and I did, and I've never blamed or associated anyone with the panic attacks.  You can accommodate the student for the rest of the term, but do not worry about the fact that you triggered an attack.

Oh yes - do I see this in other students.  Yes, I do.  I don't put them on the spot, but I do believe the faster they learn coping mechanisms, the better off they'll be in "the real world."

[post_functional]

But oseph, this is about ME, my class, my strengths and inadequacies as a teacher, what *I* could have done better, ...

Oh, wait.  No, it isn't.  Good point, oseph.

[voxprincipalis]

I did everything correctly by the book.  But I still feel so guilty.  Because I have had panic attacks myself (I did not volunteer this to the student; I just want to keep those lines in the sand firmly established) I understand how terrible it is, and I feel so awful that I did something to cause this reaction.

I think your compassion and empathy for the student are good qualities, PF. But there is no need for personal guilt, because a) you did not do anything that was wrong, b) you were unaware of the condition, so you definitely did not do it on purpose, and c) the student would have had the same reaction to being asked to do that task by any teacher, not just you. The student is reacting to the task, not to you. And the task is a reasonable task. Also, since the student knew he/she had panic attacks previously, it's not like the task you set turned an otherwise non-panic-attack-y person into someone with attacks.

You told me via PM previously some of what you were teaching -- is this a grad student or undergrad? Major? Performer? You can see where this is going -- the student will need to come up with a coping mechanism for public performance if so....

VP

[post_functional]

He/She is a graduate student performance major.  However, I should point out that panic attack triggers are often very specific.  It could very well be that he's/she's perfectly comfortable on a stage but panics in a classroom situation, for reasons known only to his/her subconscious.

At a previous school, I had a supervisor who was very unsympathetic to the requirements of disability services.  The supervisor fulfilled them, certainly, respecting the institutional mandate, but was known to say things like "these are musicians.  What are we supposed to do, offer time-and-a-half-long recitals?" (referring to accommodations like time-and-a-half on exams for students with learning disabilities). 

My view in the music field is that while there are certainly eventual limits to what disability services can accommodate--- performance majors will eventually have to perform, one way or another--- anything that can be accommodated reasonably should be accommodated reasonably.  I honestly don't have a problem exempting this student from my socratic "on-the-spot" teaching.  As long as he/she really does get it documented.

As for guilt, the guilt I feel is because I could just have an all-volunteer basis for class participation, but I don't want to.

[voxprincipalis]

Oh, no, I wasn't saying that you shouldn't accommodate. But I am thinking of all the times that as a performer I am also called upon to explain, demonstrate, ideate, etc. -- in recitals, master classes, and just general teaching. The student should be aware that there is a lot more overlap between those kinds of situations than he/she may have encountered previously, and that this overlap will only increase as he/she moves from undergrad to grad school to professional performance and/or teaching. Someone (not necessarily you) should be encouraging the student to develop a plan for coping and/or prevention based on a holistic view of what the profession entails.

VP

[msparticularity]

As for guilt, the guilt I feel is because I could just have an all-volunteer basis for class participation, but I don't want to.

I would like to suggest, though, that you meet with this student to arrive at a compromise of sorts, so they are not (visibly) the only student not getting put on the spot. I did this with my high school students who had similar accommodations, and it worked well. Basically, you just work out a secret signal for the student to give you if they are okay with being "spontaneously" called upon once you have asked a question--and they have to make a contract with you that they will actually do so. The addition of this amount of control is often enough to get around the panic, especially for a good student who is well-prepared.

Alternatively, you can require all students to bring specific comments and questions for every class meeting, and hand them in at the beginning of each class. Having the opportunity to frame the question/comment one's self is another great way to subvert panic, I have found--and it also ensures that everyone will take part in keeping the class going and engaged.

[alleyoxenfree]

As for guilt, the guilt I feel is because I could just have an all-volunteer basis for class participation, but I don't want to.

I would like to suggest, though, that you meet with this student to arrive at a compromise of sorts, so they are not (visibly) the only student not getting put on the spot. I did this with my high school students who had similar accommodations, and it worked well. Basically, you just work out a secret signal for the student to give you if they are okay with being "spontaneously" called upon once you have asked a question--and they have to make a contract with you that they will actually do so. The addition of this amount of control is often enough to get around the panic, especially for a good student who is well-prepared.

Alternatively, you can require all students to bring specific comments and questions for every class meeting, and hand them in at the beginning of each class. Having the opportunity to frame the question/comment one's self is another great way to subvert panic, I have found--and it also ensures that everyone will take part in keeping the class going and engaged.

Chime to the fact that there might be techniques to alleviate panic, and we should be merciful and kind.

At the same time, I don't agree that the student has a disability that should prevent their being called upon.  They have a disability that they should be getting treatment for.  However, being put on the spot and asked a question that is difficult is one of the things they will face in life - particularly if they are a musician!  Can you imagine a conductor being told that s/he cannot ask to hear the oboe part from the first chair, played in rehearsal in front of the rest of the orchestra, because to request that would give the oboist a panic attack?!  The student is not training to be a cataloguing librarian.  And if if s/he is, that librarian would still be expected, professionally, to be able to speak if put on the spot in a department meeting by the department head.

One thing I try to do is to talk to students about the importance of using the low stakes of the classroom - peer ridicule being the worst that can happen - to break this ice and prep for truly important professional situations.

I also sometimes allow them to say "pass" if we read aloud or if I go around the entire room for comment - at least early on.  I find that a number of them pass in the first few class periods, but quit doing so as they realize that the classroom really is just that - a low stakes training ground where they need to try things, and live to tell about it.

[post_functional]

This student is currently getting treatment.  These things take time.

I would reiterate in my famous Italics that panic triggers are often very situationally specific.  This student may not have any other problems in any other facet of musical life, except in a Socratically taught classroom situation.  

Also, the class is reasonably large enough that if I don't call on this student, it probably would escape notice.  That's also why I want the student to get a letter from DSS--- in case a whiny snowflake another student does notice, I can defend myself and the student (if nothing else by legitimately refusing to discuss it).

I would also add that emotional disorders like panic disorder and depression disproportionately affect brilliant musicians, and as such, I think a certain amount of latitude is called for.

Whether we like or not, panic disorder is recognized as a disability by ADA..  If this student wants to ask for special treatment, that's his/her prerogative, and we the faculty must comply with DSS.  

[alleyoxenfree]

Whether we like or not, panic disorder is recognized as a disability by ADA..  If this student wants to ask for special treatment, that's his/her prerogative, and we the faculty must comply with DSS.  

My point was not about the direction you've taken, which certainly seems right in terms of asking them to get some documentation. 

But it doesn't follow that because a student has a documented disability, that the student would determine whatever accommodation they would like.  Taken to its logical extreme, we wind up teaching 40 different classes - or even six or eight, - equally impossible, because the student requests it.  If even half a dozen students have conflicting disability claims, a professor may find that there is no teaching method that can be used without violating someone's rights - and that's before we discuss the rights of other students in the class not to be treated unequally.  I predict that this test case is not far off.

 But this is a larger discussion that is not really being addressed in academia, first in terms of logistics, and secondarily in terms of academic freedom to determine pedagogy.  In that case, I was trying to raise the question as to whether exempting a student who has particular career goals does them a service, or whether it would be sufficient accommodation to allow them to prepare before being called on - and extending that to the rest of the class as well.

[msparticularity]

This student is currently getting treatment.  These things take time.

I would reiterate in my famous Italics that panic triggers are often very situationally specific.  This student may not have any other problems in any other facet of musical life, except in a Socratically taught classroom situation.  

Also, the class is reasonably large enough that if I don't call on this student, it probably would escape notice.  That's also why I want the student to get a letter from DSS--- in case a whiny snowflake another student does notice, I can defend myself and the student (if nothing else by legitimately refusing to discuss it).

I would also add that emotional disorders like panic disorder and depression disproportionately affect brilliant musicians, and as such, I think a certain amount of latitude is called for.

Whether we like or not, panic disorder is recognized as a disability by ADA..  If this student wants to ask for special treatment, that's his/her prerogative, and we the faculty must comply with DSS.  

I totally agree with everything you have said. And it has also been my experience that my most brilliant students have been the most prone to panic/anxiety disorders. My suggestions are aimed at helping the student to scaffold the experience of responding in high-pressure situations--not at refusing to acknowledge the very real issues many of us face.

[biomancer]

This student is currently getting treatment.  These things take time.

I would reiterate in my famous Italics that panic triggers are often very situationally specific.  This student may not have any other problems in any other facet of musical life, except in a Socratically taught classroom situation.  

Also, the class is reasonably large enough that if I don't call on this student, it probably would escape notice.  That's also why I want the student to get a letter from DSS--- in case a whiny snowflake another student does notice, I can defend myself and the student (if nothing else by legitimately refusing to discuss it).

I would also add that emotional disorders like panic disorder and depression disproportionately affect brilliant musicians, and as such, I think a certain amount of latitude is called for.

Whether we like or not, panic disorder is recognized as a disability by ADA..  If this student wants to ask for special treatment, that's his/her prerogative, and we the faculty must comply with DSS.  

I totally agree with everything you have said. And it has also been my experience that my most brilliant students have been the most prone to panic/anxiety disorders. My suggestions are aimed at helping the student to scaffold the experience of responding in high-pressure situations--not at refusing to acknowledge the very real issues many of us face.

I'm currently doing my best to accommodate a student whose panic attacks are actually broadly triggered - basically, any time she feels stressed at all, she panics (her words).  She wants to be a nurse.  She has been under a doctor's care for a year and the medication tweaks aren't helping as much as they should.  I'll get her through my course, but if she can't get this under control, she does not have much of a chance of finishing her nursing training, or holding down a job as a nurse.  I am wondering, if the medication doesn't improve her panic attacks substantially, whether I should speak with her about how this will affect her future in nursing school and a nursing career.  Theoretically it should be her advisor's task, but our advisors are overloaded and don't get to know the students very well, and this student seems to be comfortable speaking with me.  What do you think?

[biomancer]

I'm currently doing my best to accommodate a student whose panic attacks are actually broadly triggered - basically, any time she feels stressed at all, she panics (her words).  She wants to be a nurse.  She has been under a doctor's care for a year and the medication tweaks aren't helping as much as they should.  I'll get her through my course, but if she can't get this under control, she does not have much of a chance of finishing her nursing training, or holding down a job as a nurse.  I am wondering, if the medication doesn't improve her panic attacks substantially, whether I should speak with her about how this will affect her future in nursing school and a nursing career.  Theoretically it should be her advisor's task, but our advisors are overloaded and don't get to know the students very well, and this student seems to be comfortable speaking with me.  What do you think?

Wow. The student must have considered this, right? Well, maybe not, but probably she's thinking about it and about her career choices.

If the med changes don't help, maybe she'd welcome the chance to talk about this with someone she's comfortable with. How far along is she in the nursing program? Or is she in pre-med or biology? If the panic attacks can't be controlled, it seems like she'd have to consider alternate careers.

Right now she's taking microbiology from me, and plans to enroll in the RN program next year.  She's a non-traditional student, and several of her family members are nurses.  She withdrew from my anatomy course last term, so I think she'll actually have to wait another year before she applies for the RN unless she takes anatomy elsewhere.  I'm not sure how many of the other prereqs she has finished for the RN program.  She gets noticeably anxious when she's confronted, so I'm extra-ginger about how I correct her if she's doing something incorrectly in lab.  I doubt that the faculty of the nursing school will be willing to do the kid-glove treatment during her clinical rotations, though.  I have no doubt that in her current state she wouldn't last half an hour on the floor of an ER, OR, or other "high stress" part of a hospital.

[grapenuts]

Whether we like or not, panic disorder is recognized as a disability by ADA..  If this student wants to ask for special treatment, that's his/her prerogative, and we the faculty must comply with DSS.  

My point was not about the direction you've taken, which certainly seems right in terms of asking them to get some documentation. 

But it doesn't follow that because a student has a documented disability, that the student would determine whatever accommodation they would like.  Taken to its logical extreme, we wind up teaching 40 different classes - or even six or eight, - equally impossible, because the student requests it.  If even half a dozen students have conflicting disability claims, a professor may find that there is no teaching method that can be used without violating someone's rights - and that's before we discuss the rights of other students in the class not to be treated unequally.  I predict that this test case is not far off.

 But this is a larger discussion that is not really being addressed in academia, first in terms of logistics, and secondarily in terms of academic freedom to determine pedagogy.  In that case, I was trying to raise the question as to whether exempting a student who has particular career goals does them a service, or whether it would be sufficient accommodation to allow them to prepare before being called on - and extending that to the rest of the class as well.

Determining appropriate accommodations is not as easy as this = "whatever the student would like". There is a long and lengthy process to document any disability prior to arriving in a classroom, usually with multiple different agencies in and out of academia. By that point students sometimes have a better idea of the access and resources available on campus and in the community for their particular situation. Faculty may only intersect infrequently with these resources, which are different at each institution. It depends on how often the student is faced with a situation requiring outing of the disability status and self advocating for pedagogical adjustments. From the student perspective, requesting a change in direct questioning might seem a minor change to result in major help. For the faculty it might be an important teaching tool in the class structure. I hope that it is not the only one, and that a change can be looked at as encouragement to try new techniques or strategies. Students with disabilities are not well represented at any level in academics, nor in advancing positions in rank. OP seems to have handled the situation with grace and tact.

While a bit off-topic, here is an online dissertation relating to accommodations for college age students.
edt.missouri.edu/Winter2007/Dissertation/PingryL-050407.../short.pdf

[post_functional]

That link gives me the "We're sorry. The file you are attempting to access cannot be found, or has been restricted to certain users" error message.  I'd really like to read this article.

I think alley makes a valid point and a serious one.  It could be that DSS will say that my student can only be excused from class, but will not be granted an exemption from class questioning.  But that's their call, not mine. 

I think we have to employ the bounds of reason.  No one's suggesting that we should find ways to train the blind to drive firetrucks.  DSS letters tend to be individually prescriptive.  Therefore, a prof does not have to alter his or her modus operandi on the whole; but rather the individual student may be given a particular accommodation concurrently. 

I won't deny that it's more work.  Building ramps to doorways and putting elevators in buildings is disruptive, time-consuming work too. 

I also will acknowledge that perhaps my perspective is more flexible because my field is music, which is not a life-saving field.  I can see the point about why there may be more imperative to intervene with a nursing student prone to panic attacks.  There are, obviously, limits by definition when it comes to dealing with disability.  I return to the example of having the blind drive firetrucks.  We have to have sighted people drive them for the greater good.

However, in music, some of our most lionized figures have obvious disabilities--- Bach, Beethoven, Itzhak Perlman.  Curtis Mayfield was paralyzed from the neck down and recorded a whole album in a harness, on a ventilator, recording his vocals one line at a time.  So I'm inclined to say, if I get eight different letters from DSS requiring eight different accommodations, what can I say, I'll do my best.  A lot of these just amount to "let so-and-so go to the bathroom when he needs to" or "so-and-so must sit in the front/back row".  Bounds of reason.  Many of these are not difficult to accommodate at all.

Random selection and socratic questioning is not the only method I employ in the classroom by any means.  I do sometimes foster group discussions on a more relaxed, volunteer-answer basis.  Sometimes I just lecture outright.  I did say, though, in the syllabus that random-selection questioning would be an important aspect of class participation.  I do notice that whenever the class is volunteer-answer, only the same few students seem to respond.