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[temptedknight]

I'm curious how much you "hang" out with each other, with the fellow students in your program. I'll leave the definition of "hang" to be quite broad. It could mean going out (for lunch/dinner/drinks), working together on research projects, going to events/concerts/festivals/shopping/sports together.

The reason I ask is this: When I was in a (research-based) master's program, even though my cohort was quite big (like 50 students), we still hung out, have parties, and "do stuff" within smaller groups (about 5 or 6 of us hung out together) often. But now that I'm in a doctoral program (in a different school/city), the atmosphere is quite different. There are about 10 students total in the program (all years included), and I thought that we would get to know each other quite well. Everyone else just goes to the office, goes to class, does some research work, then leave for home around 5 everyday. They also don't do joint research projects together.

I dunno, I guess you could say that I need some sort of interaction among my fellow grad students. But beyond what I need or even "want", I think it's just healthy for a program, especially one this small, to be an opportunity to get to know each other. Some have boyfriends/girlfriends, one or two people in the program are even married (although all similar ages), and I know we have lives outside of school. But seriously, when I say we don't hang out, we really don't hang out. Pop into the office, head home, then don't see each other until 9am tomorrow.

I've tried to organize a few social events with the fellow students, but it's been kind of a dud. They all have excuses, can't come, family things... I've been in the program for two years now, and honestly, even though we all work in the same building, we don't know each other outside of school. Too me, that's just not healthy, and a bit sad.

So, I'm just wondering what it's like in your programs. Maybe it's just my school/program, maybe it's just me expecting too much (I do admit the possibility, but unlikely), but I'm talking about extreme isolation of the fellow students in my program. And I mean extreme.

Thanks.

temptedknight

[scampster]

The program where I did my masters was quite social - we almost always ate lunch together, there were happy hours, invites flying around all the time, etc.

The atmosphere in the program where I did my PhD was very much like how you describe yours. I spent five years in the program and barely got any social interaction out of the group, despite trying to organize things. I have my theories as to why the two situations were so different (my masters grad program had more PhD students who were transplants and my PhD grad program had more masters students that were from the state and had stayed on from their undergrad). But it is really very program specific I think.

I never figured out how to fix the problem. In terms of my social networks in the city, I found other people to hang out with. In terms of social networks with peers in my field, I networked with other grad students at other schools at conferences quite a bit and I have a few of those contacts who have developed into friends (and many who I keep in touch with here and there).

[prephd]

Huh. We'll have lunch on class days, we've been out for drinks a couple times, we'll occasionally carpool together... we talk on the phone & email quite a bit. Beyond that, well, not much. We are all scattered inside a 2-hour radius of school, so it's not like we can hang out without some serious prep work. We've tried a couple times, but something always falls through. I don't mind, though, because I prefer to have friends with interests other than my work.

[hmaria1609]

With mine (masters), there were students who did stuff together.  Others commuted from further away so not as much.
If you can, hit the gym on campus, take in a movie night on campus, see a visiting band playing or student drama production, join a student club that interests you. Or volunteer at some place in town. You'll see more students/people outside of your major that way.

[temptedknight]

Thanks for your responses so far.

I just want to clarify two things.

First, I don't mean that everyone in my program should be "best friends" with each other. But at least, I think they should be social.

I know, yes, it is important to make friends/buddies outside of your program (or even your school), but I think the very nature of graduate programs are very different from "real-life" work. I think -- no, I believe -- that students in graduate programs should be more social with each other than colleagues in a business/company.

But yes, I guess this all really depends on the program/school. Some of you have found your situation to be similar to mine, some of you different (which I envy, I must admit). But I guess it's just that even the faculty sometimes have lunch or so with each other. But with us grad students in my program, that doesn't happen, which I, again, feel is quite unhealthy for any graduate program.

My two cents. :)

[temptedknight]

Huh. We'll have lunch on class days, we've been out for drinks a couple times, we'll occasionally carpool together... we talk on the phone & email quite a bit. Beyond that, well, not much. We are all scattered inside a 2-hour radius of school, so it's not like we can hang out without some serious prep work. We've tried a couple times, but something always falls through. I don't mind, though, because I prefer to have friends with interests other than my work.

Yeah our program, seriously we don't have drinks, we don't carpool, we don't have lunch. We just go to work/our offices, have our own lunch, then leave for the day until the next... On a scale from 1-10, with 1 being no hangout whatsoever, my program is like a -1.

[cacahuate]

I totally agree with hmaria1609's suggestion to volunteer or join a club. There might also be a cross-listed course you can take to meet knew people. It must be really hard to go from a situation where you had a lot of sociality to one where there is none. It seems fairly clear that the people in your PhD program are not too interested in changing things right now. Is there a place on campus where you could invite one or two people to walk with you to get coffee or tea? Maybe that 10 or 15 minutes would be enough to break the seal after doing so a few times. Or maybe look at web pages for other departments where the grad students might have interests that articulate with yours, and ask them to meet so you can chat about research and campus resources?

My department is really social, and my friendships with these people have been one of the reasons I have kept my sanity. I hope you are able to find some helpful advice here.

[oldadjunct]

Socializing with your peers is a very important and learned skill.   Start now; initiate it if necessary.

"Back in the day", my cohort in a very rigorous Ph.D. program decided that we all ate dinner.  You know, you do eat dinner.

So, we decided that one night a week we would rotate apartment by apartment and host a dinner for the 6-8 of us.  Simple food (tuna casserole was a favorite), no wine, eat, talk, commiserate, leave.

We were all full time students, reading expectation was maybe 1,000 - 2,000 pages a week (primary plus the "I see your Miller and raise with one Tuve and a Murrin" a gasp across the table, sweat on the forehead), writing and TA'ing.  Some of us were friends, most of us were friendly acquaintances.

I was very lucky, but it can be done.

[corny]

This is also something that can change pretty dramatically from one year to the next, as some students drift off into dissertator isolation and new cohorts arrive. My grad program was quite social when I first arrived; it became less and less so, partly because of some messy departmental politics that unfortunately put a damper on a lot of things; by the time I was a dissertator, new students who didn't know about the mess had arrived and were busy arranging happy hours and hosting dinner parties. It exhausted me just watching them. Anyway, keep trying, and if nothing else, catch the first-years early next fall. Tell them the weekly lunch (or whatever) is required and go from there.

[prephd]

So, we decided that one night a week we would rotate apartment by apartment and host a dinner for the 6-8 of us.  Simple food (tuna casserole was a favorite), no wine, eat, talk, commiserate, leave.

I love this idea, and wish it would work for my cohort... alas, I don't see any of us driving 120 miles for dinner.

[nikolite]

I also have a cohort that doesn't socialize much at all, and I admit that I am one of the biggest contributors to that.  I am married and live quite a ways from campus, and my husband and I share one car that gets traded around a lot between us throughout the day, so its difficult for me to just hang out and grab lunch with the group after classes and such.  Grad students also do not have offices in the department, so there's no atmosphere to hang around and interact with each other without making a conscious effort. 

I'd like to make more of an effort to socialize, but then most of the time I am extremely busy trying to adjust to the reading level, catching up with papers, keeping in touch with family, etc.  Its hard to fit in my colleagues. 

[verde]

My Ph.D. cohort (there are about 15 of us) is pretty social, and I think some of that has to do with the way our program is structured. Since we're required to take several of the same courses, we see each other a lot on "official business", and I suppose that's translated into closer relationships. As someone above put it, it's a mix of friends and friendly acquaintances, which is really all that I could ask for. We do happy hours/other get-togethers, have a mailing list to share info, and I'm part of a reading group (which I joined in order to have more out-of-class contact with other students). We have a fairly non-single group, so family obligations and traveling to see SOs, etc. do affect attendance, but overall we do well. 

If anyone is reading this that has the opportunity to socialize and does not take advantage of it, I would urge you to consider doing so. This isn't the first time this has been said and won't be the last, but despite their unofficial nature, the information that gets exchanged at these functions can be valuable. 

And it's fun.

[egilson]

It's been spelled out for me pretty clearly that participating in the on-going train wreck of grad student social politics in our department would make me look less serious and less competent as a student. I can understand why.

On one of my trips through our grad students' common area last spring, I heard the complaint that things "aren't as social" as someone would like. This someone showed up last fall, immediately got into a relationship with someone else, and then had an acrimonious break-up that still gets dragged out and dissected during loud daily gossip sections. Also among this cohort are the members of the 2-3 times a week happy hour bunch, including the chronic complainer (who lost funding for being unproductive but still flops down and holds forth half the day) and the "talk for hours about movies and TV and anime" guy. They go to classes, but from all appearances none of them are doing anything more than scattershot and superficial work.

I'll gladly talk with members of my cohort one-on-one, but when they're banded together I've found that they simply aren't interested in talking about research (probably because they're not doing any) or about anything above the level of pop culture and internet memes. So, I pretty much ignore them. No great loss all around.

[prephd]

This isn't the first time this has been said and won't be the last, but despite their unofficial nature, the information that gets exchanged at these functions can be valuable. 

Yes, this. I learned more in the half hour we hung out after a local conference than I did in the entire year leading up to it. Seriously.

[grasshopper]

First, I don't mean that everyone in my program should be "best friends" with each other. But at least, I think they should be social.

I know, yes, it is important to make friends/buddies outside of your program (or even your school), but I think the very nature of graduate programs are very different from "real-life" work. I think -- no, I believe -- that students in graduate programs should be more social with each other than colleagues in a business/company.

I agree. And it's not just so you have someone to commiserate with. These people will be your colleagues once you leave graduate school. Or, indeed, even while you're still a student. I've been invited to participate in a few different projects through grad school connections. They've been enjoyable, because I honestly like most of the people I've gone to school with. And they've been tremendously helpful in furthering my academic career. I can think of three things I'm working on right now that are directly related to my grad school buddy networks.

Without those connections, you're not just deprived of social activities with people who get where you're coming from. You're also losing a potentially strong professional network. Your fellow students won't always be students.


Have you considered approaching one or more of your peers with a professional opportunity? Maybe organize a small lecture series together? Or jointly put together a panel for a conference? They may not want to make the time for wine and cheese, but maybe something that will be explicitly useful, and that ties into their academic goals, might be more tempting.

I'll gladly talk with members of my cohort one-on-one, but when they're banded together I've found that they simply aren't interested in talking about research (probably because they're not doing any) or about anything above the level of pop culture and internet memes. So, I pretty much ignore them. No great loss all around.

A few years ago, someone who felt much the same way you did about the graduate students in the department was organizing a small conference. He was one of the only people working in that area in the department, so most of the grad students weren't involved. He invited them to participate in the organization of the conference by serving coffee, manning the registration table, making photocopies - that kind of thing.

When everyone declined, he lamented the sorry state of the most recent cohort of students. He felt that they didn't have the same kind of dedication to their academic growth that he had. They were obviously slackers who just didn't have what it took to make it in the dog-eat-dog world of academia. They didn't have the drive. They were just plodding along, doing their own thing - and God only knew what that was. Every time he saw them, they were wasting time in the lounge, chatting about the most inane things.

What he didn't know, because he never bothered to hang out with them, was that several of them were organizing panel sessions for a national conference, others were engaged in research projects with established scholars at other schools, still others were revising articles, and one student was on the planning committee for a highly regarded conference. They didn't have time to do his photocopying or to serve his coffee.

The thing was, when they were hanging out chatting about the daily inanities of life, they were taking a break. And that's all this guy saw.

He's graduated, by the way, and is still adjuncting. Meanwhile, many of those "slackers" are well on the track to establishing solid reputations in the field. They've helped each other out immeasurably, too. Not the poor guy, though. He wasn't around. Fell off the radar.

I'm not saying that your cohort is necessarily hiding their light under a bushel. But it doesn't hurt to be friendly with people.