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Author Topic: decision: applying for a tenure-track position now?  (Read 3110 times)
adfxiu234
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« on: August 13, 2009, 12:41:40 PM »

Currently I am on a 3-year contract position and this is the first job after I received my Ph.D. degree (I work in Humanities). Now I am wondering if I should start to look for a TT job right away. In fact, after signing this contract, other 2 TT positions turned to me and wanted to invite me to a campus visit. Since the last round of job hunting, my publication has changed a little: a forthcoming enclypeida entry has come out; a new article is forthcoming in the fall, though apparently my teaching experience has not changed at all at this moment.

Another concern is my marriage status. I divorced after getting this job and I am 37. So I think looking for a life parterner is the urgent issue at this stage of my life. I am living in deep south and I don't think people here are interested in women from other cultures - I am Chinese. I want to move to a location where people are more open-minded and then I will have better opportunities. On the other hand, I am afraid that if I did find a TT job and the location was even worse, such as a small town and a small liberal arts college, then I will remain lonely for my life.

Any suggestions and thoughts would be appreciated, since I am kind of in the crisis of my life!
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prof22
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« Reply #1 on: August 13, 2009, 01:13:18 PM »

Congrats on the 3-year contract!  Do you like the location there?  Meaning, do you feel people are open-minded?  If not, you might as well move if a better (tenure-track) opportunity arises.

I would encourage you to accept the campus visits.  You may have assumptions about particular places, but you might find out that it's not as bad.  Also, even if you visit and they offer you a job, it doesn't mean you HAVE to take it.  

Many people can empathize on your crisis.  I teach in a small town; however, it's 45 minutes from two metropolitan communities.  I choose to live in a city and commute to work.  Could that be an option for you?

Congrats on the publications too!

Take Care!
« Last Edit: August 13, 2009, 01:14:38 PM by prof22 » Logged
adfxiu234
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« Reply #2 on: August 13, 2009, 01:49:13 PM »

Thanks for the advice. I truly appreciate.

The reason that I didn't go to the campus visits is that 1), my school didn't want me to go so they didn't allow me a few more days, though they only gave me one week. If the inviting school did give me the offer and I decided to accept it, then I would damage my reputation. As a fresh face in academia, I chose to be safe. 2), After the inviting school knew that I had signed the contract, they withdrew their invitation.

So there is a lot that I learn from the job-hunting. I learnt that I have to try to get as much time as possible, like delaying my campus visit, asking for more days to make the decision, and as such. I am going to use these strategies in my next round.

Commuting is a great idea! Thank you very much. So when I look up the information about schools, I will alway set my eyes on if there is a possiblity to live nearly metropolitan areas. - Great alternative.
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mozman
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« Reply #3 on: August 13, 2009, 01:55:45 PM »

Go on the interviews.  Do not tell your current institution that you are looking elsewhere.  Take sick days if you have to.

If you get an acceptable offer, take it.  If your current institution has a problem with it, invite them to beat the offer.

If they say "no" (and they WILL say "no"), then to hell with them.  Take the new offer.  Don't worry about your reputation - people move for better offers all the time.

Look out for yourself.  No one else will do it for you.

mm
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prof22
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« Reply #4 on: August 13, 2009, 02:00:12 PM »

mozman is right!
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adfxiu234
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« Reply #5 on: August 13, 2009, 08:31:22 PM »

Forgive me for my silly questions. Why should I NOT tell my institution about my looking elsewhere? I think it is normal, understandable and legal to apply for a new job. I also think it is illegal in America to bond me with the current contract. I even suspected that my department head had already predicted that I will look for a TT job from my first talk with her. In fact, I was going to ask her to write recommendation letter for me.

What is the disadvantage if I did tell them that I am applying?

Thanks.

Yeh, I should look out myself, because nobody will do it for me.
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der_gadfly
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oy vey


« Reply #6 on: August 13, 2009, 08:55:46 PM »

Forgive me for my silly questions. Why should I NOT tell my institution about my looking elsewhere? I think it is normal, understandable and legal to apply for a new job. I also think it is illegal in America to bond me with the current contract. I even suspected that my department head had already predicted that I will look for a TT job from my first talk with her. In fact, I was going to ask her to write recommendation letter for me.

What is the disadvantage if I did tell them that I am applying?


First of all, congratulations on the new publications, (and on being employed!) Now, never never never tell a supervisor that you are looking elsewhere. This makes them look upon you less fondly. They will not expend any effort to help you with personal/professional development, AND if your supervisor is a schmuck, they could make life miserable in many small but highly effective ways. Yes, it is perfectly legal for you to look elsewhere, and in some states, with or without a contract, employment is "at will" (New York for example): either party may end the employment relationship at any time with or without cause.

If you have a great offer after going out for campus visits, you have to weigh the potential for growth against possible damage to your reputation. After a few years, most people get past their grudges. You have to do what is best for you.

Yes, finding a life partner may be a priority, but the harder you look, the less likely your ideal mate will appear. You should by all means, find a local city and do the daily commute.

Best of luck to you.
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jacaranda_
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WWW
« Reply #7 on: August 13, 2009, 10:40:32 PM »

OP:  first, if you're using your real name (or part of it) as your moniker, you should change that immediately.  You can ask the moderators to edit this thread to remove your name if that's the case (PM them).

I strongly second the advice that you should not inform your current institution when you are looking for another job.  They have not offered you a TT position, so they actually assume you will be looking for another position.  You do need to be very careful not to cancel your existing class meetings in order to do this if you possibly can.  But you should definitely pursue your options to land a tenure-track position.

As for the relationship issues, I would focus more on stabilizing your career path first.  If you just recently divorced, it may not be wise to throw yourself immediately into another long-term relationship right this minute anyhow.  This doesn't mean you need to be a nun, but it might be healthiest to seek out supportive friendships with people outside of your immediate campus community without the specific and urgent goal of feeling like you must get yourself into another serious attachment.  Good luck.
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mozman
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« Reply #8 on: August 14, 2009, 08:11:45 AM »

Forgive me for my silly questions. Why should I NOT tell my institution about my looking elsewhere? I think it is normal, understandable and legal to apply for a new job. I also think it is illegal in America to bond me with the current contract. I even suspected that my department head had already predicted that I will look for a TT job from my first talk with her. In fact, I was going to ask her to write recommendation letter for me.

This is not a legal issue.

If you have a very good relationship with your department head, and you think they will support you and write you a stellar letter, then you can talk to them.  In my experience, however, dept. heads are not this charitable - even if they say they are (at least none of mine have been).  Once you let it be known that you are looking elsewhere, you become "not a team player", and "not worth investing resources in", and many places will begin to resent you, since you are obviously disgruntled and a troublemaker - why else would you be looking elsewhere? - and if you get a better offer you may leave them in the lurch.

Now, only you can be the judge of how your chair will react.  Since you are non-TT, no sane person could hold it against you for looking for a permanent position, but many people in academia are only marginally sane at best !

If you have a senior colleague that you can TRUST to be discrete, I would talk to them before going to your chair.

Good luck,

mm
« Last Edit: August 14, 2009, 08:13:04 AM by mozman » Logged

Could you grow the foot into another patient? I mean, you are a scientist.
seniorscholar
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« Reply #9 on: August 14, 2009, 08:13:31 AM »

Forgive me for my silly questions. Why should I NOT tell my institution about my looking elsewhere? I think it is normal, understandable and legal to apply for a new job. I also think it is illegal in America to bond me with the current contract. I even suspected that my department head had already predicted that I will look for a TT job from my first talk with her. In fact, I was going to ask her to write recommendation letter for me.
/quote]

Some people on the board have found that they were disliked or "punished" by a department when it became known that they were looking. But certainly, anyone who does not have a tenure-track position should be (and is at many schools) expected to be looking. Indeed, at my large public university, we urge our non-TT full-time people (who are limited to 5 years maximum, with no renewal beyond that) to begin applying at once, have a senior member of the department offer to visit a class in the first semester in order to write a letter about quality of teaching, and so forth. We worry when they do not actively apply, since experience has taught us that many contract faculty expect they will be "so useful" that we'll offer them tenure, and when it finally dawns on them that we can not do that, become angry, depressed, fail to meet obligations, and otherwise damage the department or its students.

Second, at any of the many public colleges or universities in this state, we are required to contact your "current supervisor" before we can get funding to bring you for a campus interview. It is much better to have a letter from your chair than to have a chair be startled into expletives when receiving an unexpected telephone call from the search committee.

Best for your own comfort: seek out someone in the department who seems trustworthy and has been there for a while and ask about your situation -- that person will know the department culture and either (1) tell you it's fine to tell the chair or (2) offer to write you a reference letter as a senior colleague so that telling the chair can be postponed until you are on a short-list and may be invited to campus.
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adfxiu234
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« Reply #10 on: August 14, 2009, 06:41:16 PM »

Thanks all of you for the reply. I feel warmth on the board.

As a junior, I need more advice:

1) For jacaranda:
I don't know exactly how to change my ID. Could you please give me more clue?
By the way, I appreciate der_gadfly and jacaranda's advice on relationship.

2)For seniorscholar:
For rule Second, does it only apply to your state or to the whole U.S.? Does it only apply to public universities?

3) For  mozman:
It is hard for me to judge the chair. She is from different culture and kind of harsh when I told her about my second campus visit invite and asked for a few days delay. Yet, I sensed that she already predicted I would look for else when I first talked to her because she mentioned that publication record is important for me to look for a TT position. -  I not only need time to know her personality, but also need to time to know the culture. - It is hard.

However, I do know I might be able to trust a senior colleague there so I will definitely ask for his help.


Thanks again.
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kedves
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« Reply #11 on: August 14, 2009, 07:05:30 PM »

Thanks all of you for the reply. I feel warmth on the board.

As a junior, I need more advice:

1) For jacaranda:
I don't know exactly how to change my ID. Could you please give me more clue?
By the way, I appreciate der_gadfly and jacaranda's advice on relationship.

1.  Sign in.
2.  At very top right of screen, in the gray background, see "My Account"?  Click there.
3.  That click should take you to Profile & Settings.  Click "Username and Password," then blue "Change Your Username."
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seniorscholar
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« Reply #12 on: August 15, 2009, 08:45:13 AM »

2)For seniorscholar:
For rule Second, does it only apply to your state or to the whole U.S.? Does it only apply to public universities?

I don't know, which is why I made it clear that I answer only from my own experience on search committees -- we have to meet with the university's lawyer every year before writing the ad.

And it is very very hard to make generalizations nationally on such practices, because state law -- not federal law -- applies to most such matters. In this case, my state legislature passed a law applying to all public employees (which includes everyone working for public institutions in the state in whatever capacity, whether they're distinguished professors or local dog-catchers); and my suspicion is that they did it after several publicized cases in which a person had been discovered to have significant fabrications on their c.v. or application form. I do know that several other states have similar laws, but I have no idea how many.

As for private and church-related schools, they are free to make their own rules for just about everything; very little control is exerted by state law, and federal laws cover quite limited matters and only apply to schools that have some funding from federal sources such as the NIH, etc. In many cases, private (and especially church-related) colleges have policies much more strict than public universities; in other cases they're just different -- perhaps more strict on some issues and less so on others.
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