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[gina_byrns]

Hello everyone,

I've been teaching for the past six years: four years abroad, full-time, in an international college, and two years in the U.S. at two different universities, as a part-time lecturer. Currently, I'm about to start an MFA program and have been offered a Teaching Fellowship, so by the time I'm done with the program, I should have about 6+ years of teaching experience. I already have an MA and BA in English. I don't have a Ph.D. I am wondering what kind of a position should I be looking into when I'm out of the MFA program in two years. Do I look for assistant professor positions? Or associate professor? Basically, how do I figure out my rank with this kind of teaching background? Would I qualify for tenure-track positions? Would really appreciate some of your thoughts or if you can direct me to a thread that answers a similar question. Thanks!

[systeme_d_]

Gina, in the US, all tenure track positions begin at the level of assistant professor. 

Tenure-track assistant professors are later (hopefully) promoted to associate, usually when they earn tenure.

If the MFA is the terminal degree in your field (in other words, if most folks in your field do not earn the PhD after the MFA), then you could certainly apply for tenure-track jobs after you earn the degree.   You will probably also want to apply for positions that are not tenure-track, like VAP or Lecturer, since the market is very tight, and many, many people with terminal degrees do not get a tenure-track job right out of the gate.

[gina_byrns]

Thanks, Systeme_d. I worry that once I'm out of the MFA program, I might have to go back to square one. I wonder how my six years of teaching experience will compare to someone who's "right out of the gate" applying for the same tenure-track job. (By the way, the MFA is a terminal degree in my field, though a lot of MFAs nowadays go on and get a Ph.D. too).

[helpful]

At my institution, your years of teaching experience would be used to judge at what level of pay you begin at. You would get 'credit' and maybe a slightly shortened tenure schedule, but you would start at assistant professor level.

[svenc]

I assume you are pursuing an MFA in writing?  I'm not in your field (my SO is), so take my impressions with a a grain of salt.  

From what I've seen, teaching experience prior to starting your terminal degree usually doesn't count for much.  All the more so for teaching experience that is part-time and/or overseas.

My suspicion is that your teaching experience from before may be part of what gets your foot in the tenure-track door in a tight job market, but it won't count for much beyond that.  It certainly won't allow you to apply for anything other than entry-level positions, nor would it allow you to shorten your tenure clock at most institutions.

[systeme_d_]

I wonder how my six years of teaching experience will compare to someone who's "right out of the gate" applying for the same tenure-track job.

Not all schools are like Helpful's, so in a way, you might indeed be back at "square one." Svenc's post clarifies this. 

My suspicion is that your teaching experience from before may be part of what gets your foot in the tenure-track door in a tight job market, but it won't count for much beyond that.  It certainly won't allow you to apply for anything other than entry-level positions, nor would it allow you to shorten your tenure clock at most institutions.

In your cover letters when you are applying for jobs, you can emphasize your years of teaching experience, which could help to make you a more attractive candidate for teaching-focused schools.

Good luck!

[msparticularity]

I also want to share the experience of MrP and a lot of our acquaintances on getting an MFA--you really need the PhD in addition or instead unless you are at least a minor star. We know a number of very good writers who publish consistently (like my husband) and who decided to get an MFA so they could also get college-level employment since practically no one makes an actual living at "creative" writing :).

Fifteen or twenty years ago, this was a realistic plan, and the MFA was considered the terminal degree for working writers who intended to teach writing. Now, along with the rest of the insanity in MLA fields, an MFA really does not get the recognition it deserves, and relatively few faculty--and essentially no administrators--regard it as a terminal degree that prepares one for a teaching career. Unless you are such a star that schools will want you with even a minimal credential (in their eyes), the MFA is not going to do you any more good than the MA you already have.

[gina_byrns]

Thanks so much everyone for opening my eyes. I really don't want to do the Ph.D., at least not anytime soon, as I have a couple of writing and translation projects I have got to get on the line. Hmm, I guess my only option right now is becoming a little star overnight then. Oy vey!