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[slinger]

...and categorize students based on their demonstrated intellectual capability. That may be why teachers professors? typically adore the smart and get annoyed by the troublemakers and ones who simply might not be so smart.

This is a very interesting statement.  Can you explain this more?

[concordancia]

I've noticed that a grand majority of professors and teachers typically carry on an "elitist" sort of behavior (no offense meant to you, in any way!) and categorize students based on their demonstrated intellectual capability. That may be why teachers typically adore the smart and get annoyed by the troublemakers and ones who simply might not be so smart. That said, I don't intend to project that same behavior on myself, but I'm extremely alert and able to recall instances from virtually any moment of my past. Something like the above line (which I formulated from scratch via complex trains of thought) would instantly set off the "I didn't write this" alarm, which it didn't.

Intelligence has little to do with being a troublemaker. There are many bright troublemakers out there. There are a few not so bright ones, as well. As a matter of fact, there are probably more of the former.

[mystictechgal]

C_ C, you do realize that any time one thinks to attach the words "no offense" to one of their statements it clearly signals that they recognize that what they've just said is likely, in their own opinion, to be offensive, don't you? Saying the words doesn't erase the offense.

Given that the people who just took time to answer your question are mostly (I'm not) professors, do you really think it's a good idea to repay the favor by describing members of their profession as "elitist" and by ascribing feelings and motivations to them that are, hmm... uncharitable, at best? I don't. I'd suggest you rethink that. If nothing else, it discounts your claim that you always write in a "professional" manner, as, in this case, you've completely ignored (and insulted) the audience for whom you were writing. Bad form, to say the least.

[mended_drum]

Has there ever been an instance in which a paper was said to have been, say, 33% plagiarized, yet the "plagiarism" in question just somewhat resembled another source? For example, let's pretend a student wrote an Art History paper in which he/she discussed the elements and principles of design of a painting. Say said student described its colors as "a blend of muddy, mossy hues mixed on a smooth, marbled texture." What if that line came across as 80% similar to a post on a shower cleaning message board: "It's muddy with moss everywhere, and the colors seem whitewashed on the marble material." I dunno if I'm just looking into things or being paranoid (I only know about turnitin.com based on what I've searched on Google) but I can definitely see something like that happening.

No.  This simply does not happen to a student who writes the paper himself or herself and  knows how to paraphrase, with citation, correctly.  The two sentences you've provided above would not produce even a blip on turnitin.com.  If, however, the bulk of the paper uses vocabulary that similar to another source, it's almost certainly plagiarized, though by a clever student.  Oh, there might be a sentence or two using very similar phrases, but it won't continue throughout a paper.

[crystalline_caverns]

@mystictechgal: Indeed. I can see why I came across as rude/ungrateful, and looking back I should have revised my post or refrained from saying it altogether. I suppose just can't decipher my thoughts properly. As for what you said, two things, though: the "no offense" shpeal was intended to shine some light on the fact that I wasn't pointing the finger to new_99 in particular. I also wanted to address is that my school papers are more on the professional side and I don't tend to approach forums with the same frame of mind as writing a paper, which is usually written in a way that excels all expectations of the assignment at hand. To me, forums are more of a relaxing period in which the poster can allow himself or himself to be lost in a sea of wonder.

(P.S. being that you seem to be a mod, if you want to ban me / revise my other post and remove what I'd written, you're definitely welcome to.)

Come to think of it, the "no offense meant" had a double meaning. I wrote that with the belief that this forum seems to be clear of 'elitist' professors. It's been an absolute pleasure looking around and seeing some of the threads here, even though this is the only one I have replied to (it'll probably stay that way). Most of the posters here are genuinely interesting and are able to carry on great conversations with each other. It's magical really, and that's the reason I've been coming back.

...and categorize students based on their demonstrated intellectual capability. That may be why teachers professors? typically adore the smart and get annoyed by the troublemakers and ones who simply might not be so smart.

This is a very interesting statement.  Can you explain this more?

I'll try, but it's a bit hard to decrypt my observations into something viable.

From what I've seen, professors generally appreciate the more intelligent students. I'm assuming this is because the professors in question can relate to them: they know the students are smart are and are more likely to succeed in the long run. The students know when and how to apply and execute basic public mannerisms (which is sadly something a good handful of perhaps even college students still can't do) and are able to get along with teachers on a purely intellectual level. Troublemakers (even the smart ones) and the students who might not be so intelligent don't fit the categories as well as the "intelligent" students do. I'm sure my beliefs might be skewed, and reading this, I can tell I'm missing a lot of key points to address my thoughts, but this is just about as good as I can write it without it turning into an incoherent pile of words. My apologies.

I've noticed some of the ways professors react to certain students, and examples after examples seem to do nothing but confirm how I feel, if that makes sense. I don't mean any harm either and I also apologize if anyone takes it that way.

[mystictechgal]

@mystictechgal: Indeed. I can see why I came across as rude/ungrateful, and looking back I should have revised my post or refrained from saying it altogether. I suppose just can't decipher my thoughts properly. As for what you said, two things, though: the "no offense" shpeal was intended to shine some light on the fact that I wasn't pointing the finger to new_99 in particular. I also wanted to address is that my school papers are more on the professional side and I don't tend to approach forums with the same frame of mind as writing a paper, which is usually written in a way that excels all expectations of the assignment at hand. To me, forums are more of a relaxing period in which the poster can allow himself or himself to be lost in a sea of wonder.

(P.S. being that you seem to be a mod, if you want to ban me / revise my other post and remove what I'd written, you're definitely welcome to.)

Come to think of it, the "no offense meant" had a double meaning. I wrote that with the belief that this forum seems to be clear of 'elitist' professors. It's been an absolute pleasure looking around and seeing some of the threads here, even though this is the only one I have replied to (it'll probably stay that way). Most of the posters here are genuinely interesting and are able to carry on great conversations with each other. It's magical really, and that's the reason I've been coming back.

...and categorize students based on their demonstrated intellectual capability. That may be why teachers professors? typically adore the smart and get annoyed by the troublemakers and ones who simply might not be so smart.

This is a very interesting statement.  Can you explain this more?

I'll try, but it's a bit hard to decrypt my observations into something viable.

From what I've seen, professors generally appreciate the more intelligent students. I'm assuming this is because the professors in question can relate to them: they know the students are smart are and are more likely to succeed in the long run. The students know when and how to apply and execute basic public mannerisms (which is sadly something a good handful of perhaps even college students still can't do) and are able to get along with teachers on a purely intellectual level. Troublemakers (even the smart ones) and the students who might not be so intelligent don't fit the categories as well as the "intelligent" students do. I'm sure my beliefs might be skewed, and reading this, I can tell I'm missing a lot of key points to address my thoughts, but this is just about as good as I can write it without it turning into an incoherent pile of words. My apologies.

I've noticed some of the ways professors react to certain students, and examples after examples seem to do nothing but confirm how I feel, if that makes sense. I don't mean any harm either and I also apologize if anyone takes it that way.

To the first part of your post, directed at me: I am a mod only in that I can remove spam or duplicate postings and facilitate discussion by combining topics, splitting them if posters agree that a discussion has moved into territory where a new topic is best suited, moving them to more appropriate forums, possibly removing posts that are too self-identifying or too inflammatory (but not without discussion), etc. I do not ban, edit, or remove any posts other than those on my own. That's up to the major-mods. I am a "major" mod on another forum. Even there, I would not remove or edit your post. You have a right, within reason, to offer your opinion. You didn't make personal attacks, you didn't post anything racist, etc., ergo you made your bed, you lie in it.

On your second point, directed at Slinger: Re-read what she wrote with your thinking-hat on in light of what I said. Then quit digging.

[lasquires]

c_c, the members of this forum represent a pretty good cross-section of the profession. Your narrow experience with professors is not necessarily more representative than what you see here just because it supports your pre-conceptions.

I've met plenty of talented students who are, in fact, miserable to work with for one reason or another. I've met plenty of struggling students who are a delight. The students I most enjoy working with are the ones who are open to the learning experience regardless of innate gifts or educational background. The students I least enjoy working with are those who feel they deserve a cookie just for being a body in the classroom.

[professor_pat]

To me, forums are more of a relaxing period in which the poster can allow himself or himself to be lost in a sea of wonder.

Can I steal this marvelous quote for my sig line, C_C?

[voxprincipalis]

I don't tend to approach forums with the same frame of mind as writing a paper, which is usually written in a way that excels all expectations of the assignment at hand. To me, forums are more of a relaxing period in which the poster can allow himself or himself to be lost in a sea of wonder.

I love when people tell us why they don't feel they need to communicate clearly just 'cuz it's the interwebz. Really? That impresses nobody in this particular corner of cyberspace.

Also, you want "exceeds" rather than "excels." The words are different enough that I am surprised that someone as brilliant (excuse me, "extremely alert") as you say you are would make that error. And you say forums are a "period." No, they are not units of time. This isn't style -- just inaccuracy.

I am not in the least buying your claim that your writing is so outstanding that anyone might possibly confuse your work with something written by, well, a grownup. Even if chronologically you are eligible for voting and/or drinking privileges, none of your posts to date demonstrates the mature mastery of diction or argument with which you supposedly overflow. "Mannerisms" is not the same as "manners." The word you have written phonetically as "shpeal" has a real spelling, which is "spiel." It comes from another language, which is why its pronunciation differs from the way we might pronounce it if it were written in English. Maybe you get away with it in non-virtual life, but you are not convincing anyone here that you are the paragon of writing that you claim to be.

VP

[tinyzombie]

I don't tend to approach forums with the same frame of mind as writing a paper, which is usually written in a way that excels all expectations of the assignment at hand. To me, forums are more of a relaxing period in which the poster can allow himself or himself to be lost in a sea of wonder.

I love when people tell us why they don't feel they need to communicate clearly just 'cuz it's the interwebz. Really? That impresses nobody in this particular corner of cyberspace.

Also, you want "exceeds" rather than "excels." The words are different enough that I am surprised that someone as brilliant (excuse me, "extremely alert") as you say you are would make that error. And you say forums are a "period." No, they are not units of time. This isn't style -- just inaccuracy.

I am not in the least buying your claim that your writing is so outstanding that anyone might possibly confuse your work with something written by, well, a grownup. Even if chronologically you are eligible for voting and/or drinking privileges, none of your posts to date demonstrates the mature mastery of diction or argument with which you supposedly overflow. "Mannerisms" is not the same as "manners." The word you have written phonetically as "shpeal" has a real spelling, which is "spiel." It comes from another language, which is why its pronunciation differs from the way we might pronounce it if it were written in English. Maybe you get away with it in non-virtual life, but you are not convincing anyone here that you are the paragon of writing that you claim to be.

VP

I don't know why I'm disposed to give c_c an additional hint (I agree with everything VP wrote). But here it is.

If you Google your misspelling, Google fixes it for you.

To wit: shpeal.

[big_giant_head]

I don't tend to approach forums with the same frame of mind as writing a paper, which is usually written in a way that excels all expectations of the assignment at hand. To me, forums are more of a relaxing period in which the poster can allow himself or himself to be lost in a sea of wonder.

I love when people tell us why they don't feel they need to communicate clearly just 'cuz it's the interwebz. Really? That impresses nobody in this particular corner of cyberspace.

Also, you want "exceeds" rather than "excels." The words are different enough that I am surprised that someone as brilliant (excuse me, "extremely alert") as you say you are would make that error. And you say forums are a "period." No, they are not units of time. This isn't style -- just inaccuracy.

I am not in the least buying your claim that your writing is so outstanding that anyone might possibly confuse your work with something written by, well, a grownup. Even if chronologically you are eligible for voting and/or drinking privileges, none of your posts to date demonstrates the mature mastery of diction or argument with which you supposedly overflow. "Mannerisms" is not the same as "manners." The word you have written phonetically as "shpeal" has a real spelling, which is "spiel." It comes from another language, which is why its pronunciation differs from the way we might pronounce it if it were written in English. Maybe you get away with it in non-virtual life, but you are not convincing anyone here that you are the paragon of writing that you claim to be.

VP

Ouch, VP!  That hurt even from over here!


Back to Turnitin.com: a professor can set it so that it does not "notice" quoted material, you know.  That's how I use it; students who quote a lot of sources can still end up with a 0% similarity rate.  I teach composition classes, and I want them to learn how to paraphrase, so it's more important to me that Turnitin notice badly-paraphrased paragraphs. 

Poor paraphrasing is likely to get a student in trouble in the future; some of them think they're paraphrasing when they're actually just stealing.  Turnitin is handy for showing them how obvious this is, and how it can look like they're intentionally trying to cover their tracks.

[marigolds]

To me, forums are more of a relaxing period in which the poster can allow himself or himself to be lost in a sea of wonder.

Can I steal this marvelous quote for my sig line, C_C?

You beat me to it.  All of us just bobbing along in this magical sea of wonder; it's a...hey, I just hit a warm spot.

[cc_alan]

To me, forums are more of a relaxing period in which the poster can allow himself or himself to be lost in a sea of wonder.

Can I steal this marvelous quote for my sig line, C_C?

You beat me to it.  All of us just bobbing along in this magical sea of wonder; it's a...hey, I just hit a warm spot.

Oops. Sorry about that...

Alan

[proftowanda]

c_c, the members of this forum represent a pretty good cross-section of the profession. Your narrow experience with professors is not necessarily more representative than what you see here just because it supports your pre-conceptions.

I've met plenty of talented students who are, in fact, miserable to work with for one reason or another. I've met plenty of struggling students who are a delight. The students I most enjoy working with are the ones who are open to the learning experience regardless of innate gifts or educational background. The students I least enjoy working with are those who feel they deserve a cookie just for being a body in the classroom.

Yep.  Give me a hard-working, Cheerful C Student over a Boastful (with little basis) B Student or an Arrogant (or replace with another word that starts with a) A Student, any day.  And as I inform students, based upon my previous career in business, in which I did a lot of hiring -- and firing -- my reference letters reflect this, too. 

Now, of course, optimal are hard-working, cheerful A students, not boastful nor arrogant about abilities with which they were born or with which they were endowed by better educational preparations than many of my students enjoyed.  I just got to write a reference letter for such a student, and I enjoyed that, believe me.

[betterslac]

Professors are just like everyone else: we don't like to work with @ssholes.