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[prof_smartypants]

What's the deal here? I interviewed early on in the season for a job that I recently found out went to an internal candidate, and I *think* that the upcoming interview I have ALSO has an internal candidate.

Obviously, I'm going to go, and do my best to hit it out of the park, but what's up with this? How big of an advantage does an internal have? Do departments always go through a full search when they have a strong internal candidate, or does the fact that they are doing campus interviews at all indicate that this person isn't strong and they are seriously looking for someone new?

I hate this crap. I'm trying not to obsess, but in this market, it's very, very tough.

[mended_drum]

There are numerous threads on this topic, but it comes down to this:

1. Sometimes a job is described and advertised with a particular candidate, often internal, in mind.  In those cases, it can be that person's job to lose--which can certainly happen.
2. Sometimes an internal candidate will be delighted at the appearance of a job which seems perfect for him or her, but discover that familiarity breeds contempt, and the exciting unknown applicant gets the job.  In fact, the service and teaching done by the internal candidate may, in some cases, make him or her less competitive for the job if such a candidate is not able to keep up an active enough research agenda at the same time.
3. All other things being equal, most internal candidates probably have either a slight edge or a slight disadvantage, depending on their relationship with the department for whom they work.

But most of all:  there is no sure way for someone outside of the department to know which of these three circumstances is in play and absolutely nothing you can do about it in any case.  Venting may help you blow off steam, but there is no point obsessing about the situation.

[watermarkup]

I backed out of an interview last year for several reasons--bad timing, an offer already on the table, and a strong internal candidate who fit the job description perfectly. Guess who didn't get hired? Both of us.

[kamiakin]

4. The strong internal candidate is so strong she finds a better job somewhere else.

As I have posted before, I was an unsuccessful internal candidate once.

You show up and do your best. Good luck!

[galactic_hedgehog]

I once had a campus interview where where there was a VAP in the slot they were  doing the search for.  Was he an inside candidate?  Maybe.  He may not have applied.  He may have applied and might not have made the short list.  Maybe he was a finalist.  Maybe he already accepted a t-t offer from another school.  You know what?  There wasn't anything I could do except do my best during the interview and convince the SC that I was the best person for the job. 

I met the VAP during my visit and had a chance to talk to him both before and after my talk.  He was a nice and interesting guy.  He asked one or two good questions and asked me for a reprint.  If I ever run into him at a meeting somewhere, I won't feel odd about going up to him and we'll have something to talk about (apart from science).

Guess what?  I didn't get it.  Know what else?  Neither did he.

[ruralguy]

There's really just no way to answer this definitively.

We have had apparently strong internal candidates not get the job---
someone stronger comes around. It happens. At the begining of the process we (or at least my dept.) tells all internal candidates that there is no promise implied or written that you will get an interview or get the job. We try to treat people kindly during the process, but we can give no advantage, unless they deserve it (i.e., we'll give them the job if overall everyone agrees they are best for it)

Of course, extremely strong internal candidates who just happen to be internal do have a definite advantage, and our school has indeed had a couple of those.

I'd say all in all, a moderately talented internal candidate probably has a slight advantage, especially if no one real strong applies.
The dept. or dean would probably rather give the job to the so-so
internal person as long as they seem like they'd probably get tenure and generally not cause problems. But sometimes searches like this get stopped by the Dean. Also, outcomes are someone determined by desirability of the school, and whether the internal person gets better offers, etc.

A fairly weak internal candidate probably has no advantage.

A lot of this depends on timing---if you apply for a job for which someone internal has been there for 3 years, filling in for sabbatical leaves and being wonderful, then, you might be screwed. Ah well.

How "internal" are most internal candidates anyway? Many haven't even been there for half a year yet, and almost none have been there more than a couple of years. Its not like they are entrenched chronies.

[losemygrip]

This is probably the second most-discussed topic around here.  In our two searches, both had internal candidates.  One of them didn't even make the short-list (much to my surprise, as I thought the committee would be afraid to do this).  The other one is a campus finalist (which has the virtue of being a cheap interview).  I'm having a very hard time being objective about this person, because there are both positive and negative things I've experience that are coloring my judgment.  I'm just hoping someone is going to bomb his/her job talk(s).  Preferably all but one of them on each search.  Then it'll be easy.

On the whole, in my experience internal candidates do have the edge, but it certainly varies widely.  I think if the internal candidate was the result of a national search for a temp position, his/her edge is definitely greater, as long as s/he did a good job.  What drives me crazy is when the local yokels from Mid-Southeastern State down the road with very little professional accomplishment are chosen over exciting candidates with superior credentials just because they're comfortable and familiar and won't challenge anyone. 

[georgiaprof]

With my last search, we settled on two candidates.  One internal and one external.  The internal was generally a pain, but got an interview anyway (bad pool).  The external learned that we were interviewing an internal and so refused the interview.  We offered the position to the internal due to the profound lack of choice.  The internal left (did not go to another position - hu just left).  The external would have gotten the job if hu had just come to the interview and not spewed pea soup everywhere.

Now, we can't search due to budget cuts - so we have lost the position because the external decided that only internals are ever hired.

[prof_smartypants]

Thanks. This is all very helpful. I never considered withdrawing from the search, I'm just trying very hard not to get emotionally invested in this position before I get an offer (a good idea, regardless...). My concern stems from the fact that I had been "burned" in my previous interview - after reading the job listing and the internal's bio it was quite clear that the job ad had been written expressly for her.

Like you all said, it's really irrelevant, and I have no way of knowing what's in the SC's mind. I'm just another job candidate getting increasingly desperate and paranoid.

As always, the answer is to get off the interwebs, drink more, and obsess less.

[spectacle]

With my last search, we settled on two candidates.  One internal and one external.  The internal was generally a pain, but got an interview anyway (bad pool).  The external learned that we were interviewing an internal and so refused the interview.  We offered the position to the internal due to the profound lack of choice.  The internal left (did not go to another position - hu just left).  The external would have gotten the job if hu had just come to the interview and not spewed pea soup everywhere.

Now, we can't search due to budget cuts - so we have lost the position because the external decided that only internals are ever hired.

Wow that's silly.  I've seen internal candidates humored out of convenience - they're already here, so it doesn't cost anything to interview them.  I'd say I've seen internals get the job maybe half the time.  I'd never in a kazillion years just give up because there was an internal candidate.

[macaroon]

My concern stems from the fact that I had been "burned" in my previous interview - after reading the job listing and the internal's bio it was quite clear that the job ad had been written expressly for her.

Have you gotten the letter yet saying that they have hired someone?  Thing is, even if the job ad was written for an internal candidate, that internal candidate could totally get an offer elsewhere and take a different job. 

[prof_smartypants]

My concern stems from the fact that I had been "burned" in my previous interview - after reading the job listing and the internal's bio it was quite clear that the job ad had been written expressly for her.

Have you gotten the letter yet saying that they have hired someone?  Thing is, even if the job ad was written for an internal candidate, that internal candidate could totally get an offer elsewhere and take a different job. 

Yes, they called me - really nice phone call - to let me know they had hired someone else. Then they posted their new hire on their website with her bio, which indicated that she had been a post-doc/VAP there last year, and her bio very closely matched the job description.

I don't hold anything against them - they actually might have an opening next year that is an even better match for me - but the whole experience made me wary about my upcoming interview (and a suspicious VAP on their faculty website...)

[mh_rose]

Can I ask why/how you *think* there is an internal candidate for the job you have yet to interview for?

[glowdart]

Can I ask why/how you *think* there is an internal candidate for the job you have yet to interview for?

When the faculty website reveals a Visiting Assistant Professor Underwater Basketweaving with a speciality in North Atlantic Cod Bones and Their Use in Basket Structural Engineering and the ad for the position at the school asks for that exact thing... it is usually a good sign.

But, as noted below, not always a sign that they will get hired. 

[drsmarty]

I was twice the outsider who got the offer over the insider. I accepted in both cases.  In the first case, I was told immediately after I arrived in the Fall that this was the case and that any cold shoulder I received would likely be from those who wanted the insider. I stayed at that U for 5 years and everyone warmed up.  It was one of my best U experiences!

In the second case, I was preferred over the internal and there have been no issues.  This is my current employer.

Finally, I was a candidate for a position and discovered the night before my interview (at 10pm no less), that not only was the other candidate an insider, but that candidate would be offered the job. I learned this info from a friend who adjuncted at the college and had a friend on the search committee.  She'd contacted the SC friend when I first applied for the job, but she got back to her at 10pm the night before the interview. I went anyway, gave my presentation with vigor (hoping against hope) but the job went to the other candidate.