soleilsun
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« on: February 12, 2009, 12:35:04 PM » |
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My husband and I have been commuting long -distance for several years and tried, in vain, to resolve the dual career problem. It has been very frustrating to say the least. We finally decided to get pregnant (and succeeded on the first try), since I am in my mid-30s. Hubby was going to move into a postdoc/soft money research position (much inferior to the great tt job he has now) in my location. I have a terrific, tenured job in a good location. I am in my first trimester. We were pretty happy, although not an ideal outcome to our career struggles for him. Now hubby got an interview invitation to his dreamjob (literally) in our dreamlocation (we've always dreamed of that location - he applied before we knew about pregnancy). He has excellent chances - they are flying out very few candidates for multiple positions, he knows some of the faculty and he is an excellent interviewer (the problem is getting the interviews). It is VERY likely he'll get the job. Of course, that dreamlocation is far from my tenured job. What to do??? If it weren't for the pregnancy, of course, I'd want him to go for it, and then I would go on the market yet again, and try my best to get a job at our dreamlocation - if that worked, we'd be in a state of bliss. With the pregnancy, can I really manage to go on the market again next fall with an infant - I imagine I am going to be exhausted, and the job search uncertainty would certainly cloud the joys of motherhood. I may also not be in the best shape intellectually (no sleep, stress of first time motherhood, no family to help etc.) - so my chances would likely be greatly diminished (given that I have tenure at a terrific job - and hubby is tt in a field with much worse salary prospects, I would only consider a couple of places in dreamlocation). Yet another alternative is for me to wait a year or two to go on the market, and one of us be the primary care-giver for the kid, with the partner doing most of the commuting. Not what I imagined our life as parents to be like, and a depressing prospect. Of course, since it's still very early into the preg, we could terminate and go for option number 1 with a good shot at a dream outcome for both of us (and try again a year from now). I am pro-choice...but it's not perfect either (I am so far having a very good pregancy, no nausea, no exhausting, nothing). Any thoughts?? We've been wrecking our brains over this.
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soleilsun
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Posts: 11
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« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2009, 12:37:19 PM » |
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Oh, I should add, we are talking about a commute involving planes - definitely not short distance.
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scheherazade
1/3 of the Triumvirate of Evil and the Most Delicious
Distinguished Senior Member
    
Posts: 7,105
Running feminist prostitution rings since 1998
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« Reply #2 on: February 12, 2009, 12:43:23 PM » |
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Let him interview. Don't overthink it until he has an offer. Is it possible for him to get you a spousal hire position?
Yes, you will probably be exhausted with an infant. I've been through two, one of them as a single mom. You'd be surprised what you're able to do. My opinion may not be popular, but I think it's silly to terminate a pregnancy you wanted and tried for because of possible job issues.
If he gets an offer, you can discuss this more, but I'm sure you know that with a two-body problem, there needs to be quite a bit of compromise, and things often don't shake out the way we imagine. Until you come to the conclusion that that is OK, you're going to struggle with this.
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You historians disturb me sometimes.
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secretweapon
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« Reply #3 on: February 12, 2009, 12:45:39 PM » |
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I don't know whether to offer congratulations or commiserations. Here are a few observations:
- If you were not pregnant, you would still not be close to achieving the dream outcome, since it would mean your husband going to Dreamlocation and you staying in TTville. Dream outcome is both of you in the same place, preferably Dreamlocation.
- If your husband gets the job, does he have any negotiating power to get something for you?
- If your husband gets the job, can you negotiate a leave of absence of one year and go with him? Less income, of course, but then you get the benefit of living in the same location and having time at home with the baby.
- Just because you got pregnant easily one time, does not mean that you will again. You just never know.
- Be prepared to take some heat for considering a termination. Just warning you. Hopefully, this will not turn into a debate on the A-word.
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« Last Edit: February 12, 2009, 12:46:31 PM by secretweapon »
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If you want a cookie, bake a cookie.
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onestep
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« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2009, 12:58:24 PM » |
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Yea, wait until he has an offer. When he does, then negotiate like crazy for a dual-hire. If you've been productive in your field and if he's a hot candidate, there's a chance they will bring you both. It's a tough one for sure, but still a possibility.
Of course the choice is yours, but I also agree that if you've been trying and in your mid 30's, then you should have the baby. I might have the numbers wrong, but I think there's a 15% chance per month of conception for people actively trying (who don't have medical issues), so you got pretty lucky this time around.
Can you take a sabbatical or unpaid leave for a year or two?
[On preview, I see that secretweapon already raised these points!]
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mended_drum
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« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2009, 01:07:58 PM » |
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Any chance your current employer would work to find a tt job for your spouse if it looked like they were going to lose you? Probably not, in this economy, but I'd be looking at possibilities for both spouses in both potential locations before making a choice.
Frankly, though, if you both have full time jobs where you are, I'd want a dual hire before I'd move. Breaking up a family so that one member can get a dream job when both have a solid-if-not-quite-dream job would be an awfully hard thing for me to contemplate.
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soleilsun
New member

Posts: 11
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« Reply #6 on: February 12, 2009, 01:18:30 PM » |
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Just to clarify - we have been commuting long-distance for years- but with the pregnancy, hubby was planning to move into a postdoc type position at my location. No shot at negotiating a spousal position for him at dreamlocation (he is tt, I am tenured, we are in different schools, and it's not the type of uni to do that - we've got plenty of experience in that area:) Also no shot of getting sth at my uni for him (they don't even have his dept) -and he has of course looked at all other schools within a 2-3 hr driving distance. I won't be able to negotiate a leave beyond the few weeks of maternity leave, as I was just on a leave for part of last year. I will still need to teach two classes next fall. I do think without an infant to care for and recovering from a c-section (which I already know I have to have), I would be in a much better position to interview and get an offer at one of the two places in dreamlocation in the fall. And without the baby, I'd be thrilled to give it a shot. I am just trying to imagine what it would feel like for me or hubby to be a quasi single parent for a year or more likely two (if I were to go on the market in fall 2010, when I should be back into shape). It just feels terrible, especially with no other family around. The worst part is that we had just settled into the thought of being parents here in my location, found a possible house we liked, etc...
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goldendragon
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« Reply #7 on: February 12, 2009, 08:53:12 PM » |
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You could give the child up for adoption and go on the market after that. It doesn't sound like you truly want or wanted to have the child if you're considering termination. If you do have it, it wouldn't be an ideal situation for any of you.
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crowie
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« Reply #8 on: February 12, 2009, 11:06:53 PM » |
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Have you and your husband talked realistically about him pulling out of the dreamlocation search? It would be a sacrifice but it sounds like you guys were actually feeling pretty good about things before this "dream" came along.
The other alternative is to seriously consider going on the market this Fall after the birth of the baby. You're obviously successful in your field, tenured, with a terrific job. Maybe you just need to have confidence in yourself. You say you don't have family etc. around to help out, but if you have a good tenured job maybe you are making enough money to hire a good nanny to care for your baby when you are preparing applications, doing campus visits etc.?
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macaroon
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« Reply #9 on: February 13, 2009, 09:16:18 AM » |
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You say you don't have family etc. around to help out, but if you have a good tenured job maybe you are making enough money to hire a good nanny to care for your baby when you are preparing applications, doing campus visits etc.?
Work trips with a baby when you are a single parent (or effectively one) is surprisingly easy, albeit not terribly cheap. Most hotels can get you in touch with a "bonded" or "licensed" nanny service. You take the baby with you, and the hotel helps you arrange on-site care. I have never had to use this myself, but friends of mine have done it. Nobody that I know of has had a bad experience. The bonded nannies that work for the hotels are not "crappy" nannies. They are either nannies that are between long-term jobs, or they are nannies who don't want the pressure of a long term job. The latter are mainly bored grandmotherly types or retirees. A friend of mine did this frequently, and says most of the time, her kids had an absolute blast when they went to conferences with her.
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t_r_b
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« Reply #10 on: February 13, 2009, 11:43:15 AM » |
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You are overthinking this. Take it one question at a time, starting with the most important, namely:
Do you want to have this child? It sounds like you're trying to talk yourself out of it. My own guess is that you do want it, but you're having second thoughts, which is entirely normal. But whatever you decide you want, it makes zero sense - zero - to worry about the other stuff before you've resolved this question. Deciding to have this child, or not have this child, will change the rest of your life in incalculable ways. Once you find clarity on this point, then you can figure out the rest.
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If you want to be zen, then stay in the freaking moment.
A lot of the people posting on this thread need to go out and get kohlrabi.
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sibyl
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« Reply #11 on: February 13, 2009, 11:54:57 AM » |
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Don't make any decisions until and unless spouse has an offer in hand. It hurts nothing for spouse to interview at dreamlocation and play the thing out.
Why do you think you won't be able to get leave? Under FMLA, your employer must give you up to 12 weeks of unpaid leave after the birth of your child. Since you are early in the pregnancy, that must take you through most of fall 2009; you could probably negotiate to tack it onto the end of paid leave. You can spend the fall (and summer) applying for jobs in dreamlocation when you are not caring for (or sleeping along with) your baby. It sounds as though the time would be more important to you than the money.
I was startled by goldendragon's blunt advice -- but then I thought it was good medicine. It's not unreasonable to put your careers ahead of pregnancy, and if you had decided to postpone trying to get pregnant until your careers were settled, it would be a little easier to think about it. But if your careers are more important than the birth of this particular child in this particular year, then maybe termination or adoption is the way to go. There are risks in that path, too, but you know that.
Good luck.
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"I do not pretend to set people right, but I do see that they are often wrong." -- Jane Austen, Mansfield Park
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oseph
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« Reply #12 on: February 13, 2009, 12:09:39 PM » |
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You are overthinking this. Take it one question at a time, starting with the most important, namely:
Do you want to have this child? It sounds like you're trying to talk yourself out of it. My own guess is that you do want it, but you're having second thoughts, which is entirely normal. But whatever you decide you want, it makes zero sense - zero - to worry about the other stuff before you've resolved this question. Deciding to have this child, or not have this child, will change the rest of your life in incalculable ways. Once you find clarity on this point, then you can figure out the rest.
trb gives good advice - and not only do you have to decide whether you want this child, but also you need to think about whether you (collective you - you and your husband) are going to be okay with your choice regardless of how your careers turn out. This isn't about trying to make you feel bad about deciding that careers are most important or that children are most important - it is a personal decision that reflects not on your 'essential goodness or badness' or something like that as a human being but on what you want out of life. What you do not want, however, is to have the baby and then realize that you really wanted to prioritize your careers and now regret letting the baby interfere with that. Mr. Oseph and I are at the point where we are okay (sad but okay) if Baby Oseph's needs end up derailing our academic careers and require more serious compromise on what we do to make money, even though of course we are trying as hard as possible to make both work out. Baby Oseph could turn out to be a special needs child and require extra attention. We might need to change careers in order to make enough money to raise him in a secure environment. We might need to change careers in order to keep our marriage together. It took a couple of months to get to this mental place, but we did, although it was a struggle throughout my entire pregnancy. Again - not a judgment call at all re: your priorities - just that you need to think about what they are, even if you're trying for both. Good luck!
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Oseph....you are right and you make sense.
For your future comments, I insult very directly.
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twanda
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« Reply #13 on: February 21, 2009, 03:08:45 AM » |
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Think about what you will regret in the grand scheme of things long after you/SO have retired: leaving a tenured job, potentially not having children, continuing the dreadful commute or knowing spouse lost out on dream job? Are you at your dream job? If not, why not let him have a shot since you both said this was the dream location? Not that everyone needs (or should have) children but I would also caution just because it happened easily once doesn't mean it will happen again (this has happened to friends). Would you be ok with that? I concur with the other posters, have him move forward on the interview. If you believe you have a reasonable shot of finding a new position in dream location next year then you should have a reasonable shot the following year. If he gets the dream job, you both get the dream location and most excitingly each other and a beautiful baby after being apart and waiting for so long. Everyone reacts to pregnancy differently, you may do very well, you may decide motherhood is the best thing since sliced bread and there is the horrible prospect that you may not make it to term even if you want to. If worst came to worst and you couldn't do the job search with an infant, would if be horrible to resign and move with hubby, take a year to relish your time with the new baby and then look the following year? Quality of life is not to be underestimated, its extremely important. It sounds like hubby has been very willing to move for your career, are you willing to do the same considering the situtation? From the outside this seems like potentially an opportunity for both of you not just him.
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profmom3
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« Reply #14 on: February 27, 2009, 08:37:41 AM » |
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Hrmmm...ditto all the above. I'd wait to decide or say *anything* to *anyone* professionally until you had a firm understanding of the dream job options. That said, being on the market/traveling with a little one isn't so hard after they're about 2 months old or so. At least it was not in my case - travel isn't terrible when they are not particularly mobile, and after I recovered from a bad labor/emergency c-section I was ready to be thinking about other things at about 8 weeks. So teaching/research/etc with a little one was a good thing for me. I did go on several campus interviews here I had to ask for breaks in my schedule to pump, but these were accommodated. I know it seems overwhelming but you just get used to travel/routine with the little monsters. I will say that this year spouse and I have been lucky enough to live in the same house, but have *significant* commutes to our positions, which severely curtails the help each can provide the other in terms of daycare pick ups, dropoffs, back up childcare, grocery shopping, etc. Because of this, my parter is leaving a TT position at a school that he's not happy in (at all) to follow me to my TT position at a much bigger, better school in an area we'd like to live. He's got a p-t VAP lined up, dept. has a good track record of spousal placement, and if not we play hardball next year with him going back on the market after giving it a good faith effort. All in all, for us we will be much happier in the same place and with more time for our kid. But it is all about what you two are comfortable with and your long term goals.
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