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[sciencephd]

I've never heard of Midwest University. A bit of internet research indicates that it is a bible college, and that all of the PhD's that it offers are in 'church things', for example, "Church music", "Christian Counseling", etc.

So, hands down, I guess the answer is Howard University for a PhD.

(unless, perhaps, you want a PhD in "church music").

The lack of R1 status is central to the perception of the value of a PhD from any university.

If you think that is not the case, then provide counter-examples of PhD programs or points that are relevant to the academic world. 

Harvard, btw, is an R1.

This is obvious, and like I said before, besides the point.  Yes, I know that R1 status is important, that's a given. 

Look, the real question is whether a hiring committee would value a degree from an HBCU higher than a degree from a predominantly white LAC, after knowing that demographic differences of each school, beyond R1 status.  For instance, how would a hiring committee view an applicant receiving a doctorate from Howard U versus an applicant receiving a doctorate from Midwest U?

[locutus]

Look, the real question is whether a hiring committee would value a degree from an HBCU higher than a degree from a predominantly white LAC, after knowing that demographic differences of each school, beyond R1 status.  For instance, how would a hiring committee view an applicant receiving a doctorate from Howard U versus an applicant receiving a doctorate from Midwest U?

So basically, all things being equal (which they never are) would a degree from an HBCU help, hurt, or neither?

If I had to pick one I'd say hurt, but that's just based on my own lingering cynicism. The reality of how this actually plays out for those graduates is much more complicated and varied. There are many more things to worry about other than this particular hypothetical situation. I understand wanting to think this over and figure out the answer. But isn't it to some degree pointless as compared to thinking about how to help current HBCU students end up with kick ass CVs?

[nikolite]

I've never heard of Midwest University. A bit of internet research indicates that it is a bible college, and that all of the PhD's that it offers are in 'church things', for example, "Church music", "Christian Counseling", etc.

So, hands down, I guess the answer is Howard University for a PhD.

(unless, perhaps, you want a PhD in "church music").

Well, I'm sure there are people who'd love a PhD in church music.  Honestly, I made up Midwest U as a generic name (I suspect you knew that).  But that's interesting enough that its real!  But the fact that you looked this up sounds like you might be...  well, maybe let this decide: http://www.okcupid.com/tests/take?testid=9935030990046738815

Locutus, I think you're right that HBCU graduates should just make sure they have great CVs, as all graduates should.  But I was just speaking of the hypotheticals in light of the thread topic.  In reality though, it's quite varied.  It doesn't have to be the kiss of death if they make sure they are top notch with publications, teaching experience, etc. I guess.

[sciencephd]

The fact that I "looked it up" means that I am an academic.  The fact that I took you at your word, having asked for an example, but that it was, in fact, not a legitimate example and you were just making s*** up, says everything about you.

This is an academic forum.

[locutus]

The fact that I "looked it up" means that I am an academic. 

No, it means you're being obtuse. I'm an academic and I didn't look it up.

This is an academic forum.

It is also at times an overly pedantic forum.
Though those two may be related.

[sciencephd]

Oh, you're both going to enjoy grad school.

[locutus]

Oh, you're both going to enjoy grad school.

Enjoyed.

[nikolite]

The fact that I "looked it up" means that I am an academic.  The fact that I took you at your word, having asked for an example, but that it was, in fact, not a legitimate example and you were just making s*** up, says everything about you.

This is an academic forum.

Is this an academic forum or a forum for academics (and aspiring academics)? 

Midwest U meant insert any average midwestern university.  Sort of like Foreign U or Small Private College.  And my example was not the counter-example that you asked for, as I had already told you that I agreed with you that R1 status was relevant.  No one has had an issue with that point.  My example was a simple hypothetical situation that would help you understand my questioning and line of thought, since you were so caught up with R1 status.  I guess it flew too far below the mind of an academic. 

But really, you should take the test (I was quite proud of my result).  It was a joke, although I guess an ill-suited one, given that you seem uber-serious about your status on the fora.  You're also being snarky and pompous for the thrill of it so I'll just end the discussion here.

[manolo]

I'm weighing in a bit late here.  However, my short answer is "no", a Ph.D. from an HBCU is not (in general) a kiss of death.  Let me say that, going forward, this is my PERSONAL opinion.  At the end of the day, how do you present yourself, what research/scholarship are you doing, and the biggie, are you good at networking?

On the other hand, I do NOT think that all HBCUs are created equal (just as all PWI's are not).  Also, I think (as others have noted) that it largely depends on the field of study.  I am not in the sciences (nor in one of the traditional humanities fields), but I know of at least one HBCU with a very strong and popular graduate program.  I attribute the success not only to the faculty/administrators, but also to the students who came from a range of undergraduate institutions (i.e., Georgetown, Boston University, University of Central Florida). 

[post_functional]

I've never heard of Midwest University. A bit of internet research indicates that it is a bible college, and that all of the PhD's that it offers are in 'church things', for example, "Church music", "Christian Counseling", etc.

So, hands down, I guess the answer is Howard University for a PhD.

(unless, perhaps, you want a PhD in "church music").

You say that as though getting a PhD in "church music" was something profoundly silly.  Palestrina wrote a lot of "church music."  So did J.S. Bach.  A lot of musicologists from R1s specialize in sacred music.  "Church music" is the cornerstone of repertory for choral conductors with PhDs.  Composers with PhDs and DMAs can write "church music" as their dissertations.

There are a lot of ways to "get a PhD in church music."  And from perfectly respectable R1s.

[sciencephd]

I've never heard of Midwest University. A bit of internet research indicates that it is a bible college, and that all of the PhD's that it offers are in 'church things', for example, "Church music", "Christian Counseling", etc.

So, hands down, I guess the answer is Howard University for a PhD.

(unless, perhaps, you want a PhD in "church music").

You say that as though getting a PhD in "church music" was something profoundly silly.  Palestrina wrote a lot of "church music."  So did J.S. Bach.  A lot of musicologists from R1s specialize in sacred music.  "Church music" is the cornerstone of repertory for choral conductors with PhDs.  Composers with PhDs and DMAs can write "church music" as their dissertations.

There are a lot of ways to "get a PhD in church music."  And from perfectly respectable R1s.

Neither Bach nor Palestrina got a PhD in something called church music, in a School of Church Music.

http://www.midwest.edu/kang/eng/school/01music/01music_03ma.asp

If you want to start an argument about something that has nothing to do with the thread topic,  at least read for context.