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[admithopeful09]

Hello.

    For the past three months I have been researching schools I want to attend next year (Master's in Higher Education Admin/Student Affairs) and have finally settled on 7-8 that I want to apply to. The problem is, I don't really have any idea how "good" they are. I feel like I've done a lot of research but haven't come up with the answers I'm seeking. I've gone on all their websites (numerous times), contacted students who either attended or currently attend the programs and checked out both the NASPA and ACPA websites. I even bought an online subscription to U.S. News and World Report to get the rankings, but then someone told me that the graduate school rankings are based on the doctoral programs rather than the master's. So I guess my question is, how can I find out how good a master's program is within the school and really, how much of a difference will this make when I go to find a job? Thanks.

[pink_]

Why don't you try asking people who are working in the field you want to enter after you're finished?  Or ask professors from your undergrad.  Or look to see what kind of success graduates of these programs have found when they're done.

[zharkov]

The overall rep of the school as a whole also means something.  To to sure, there are great schools with a few so-so programs, and some excellent programs in so-so schools.  But as far as perception goes, the overall rep of a school means a lot.

[litcrittr82]

Just from observation from having a former partner who was in grad. school for student affairs and now works in the field, there were quite a few people who graduated from her student affairs program (a so-so program at a well-known and highly selective school) and went on to get jobs rather quickly in the region.  As far as I know, almost all of them who went into the field after grad. school were snatched up by nearby universities of good but lesser repute who, according to ex-partner, were keen on having people on staff from the flagship university of the region.  It's not always a good idea to limit yourself regionally if you can help it, but it seemed like the reputation of the overall university was a significant part of the equation.  This is just anecdote, of course, but possibly worth investigating when you ask about job placement.

[admithopeful09]

Thanks for all the responses; they've really helped and I appreciate it.

Or look to see what kind of success graduates of these programs have found when they're done.

I guess that is what kind of worries me about a few of the programs on my list. I know one that is sounds great, looks like it has interesting classes, and provides an assistantship with tuition waiver as well as $20K stipend (and health and dental insurance!), but some of the schools the graduates end up working at I've never even heard of. Not that that is in any way the mark of a great school, but a lot of the schools are not in a major metropolitan area, which is where I would want to work and live after I graduate.

[pink_]

Tuition waivers and stipends are hard to be, especially with the current economy. 
I think, and I am not in your field so take this with a grain of salt, that the most important point is whether graduates get jobs or not.  Where they get those positions is a secondary concern.  I'm not saying that it doesn't matter, but you can't know whether those jobs are an accurate reflection of the degree or not.  Maybe these grads wanted to live in smaller towns vs. big cities.  Maybe not.  But at this stage, I would apply widely and see what happens.  Hopefully you get accepted to a couple places, and you can make the decision about which program to attend by considering these kinds of issues.  If you are admitted, it is perfectly reasonable to ask the director of the program (or whomever your contact person is) about job placements and strategies the program might have to help students find positions.  You can ask these questions earlier in the process, but you might not get the same answers, if you get answers at all.

[psychprof]

Of course you want to get into the best program possible. Good!

It is somewhat difficult (as you found out) to find out independently what master's programs are the best. I would say, however, that many of the programs in US NEWS, even though they do rate the doctoral programs, would apply equally to the masters programs. So, I think that this can be a good guide.

Sometimes it is difficult to tell from where people work how good the school is. THis is because some schools attract a more regional student base who also tends to stay geographically closer to where they went to school. So, the notion that most graduates get jobs is a good one, as long as the jobs are the kind of job you want.

I would say this, though, that masters programs that give tuition waivers and assistantships are not all that common, so I would think seriously about going to a place like would offer you this level of support. It will make a huge difference in your graduating without debt! That is good, as sometimes entry level student affairs jobs aren't tremendously high paying.

Good luck!

[happy_camper101]

Hi. I'm also searching for a SA/HE program. I know what you're talking about when you find that the sites for these assistantships/internships aren't getting you experience on where you want to work. What I would do is go to those Metropolitian areas and find out where people went to school there. I went about doing my grad school search by conducting informational interviews at different schools around my area and talking to different student affair staff/administrators on whether their school prepared them for their job. It gives you a better idea of what schools need to do to prepare you for the field and what programs are already doing that.

Another thing I want to say is, we can NEVER be FOR SURE what schools are absolutely good because each person measures whether a school is "good" differently and even within a program people have differing opinions about their program. If you mean "good schools" are ones that prepare you greatly for a job, then look for programs that have good internship/assistantship experiences and ones that allow you to venture out beyond the local regional areas. You can always utilize the summer time to find these experiences outside of where you go to school. Talking to a person who is already working in the job you want to get into will help a lot.

Like Pink Lady said, the percentage of graduates obtaining jobs is also something very important to consider. I would look for programs that have a mix of both academic professors and seasoned student affair professionals teaching the classes so you get a well rounded education. You should reflect on why you want to work at a Metropolitan school--what features, aspects of working in that area are you attracted to and what challenges will you face. Then go back to the graduate schools you are interested in and ask them how their programs will help you learn and address these challenges. Hope that helps.

[dr_prephd]

USNWR does have a category for top master's universities by region (south, west, etc.). I'm not sure if it goes by department, though.

The other posters' advice about job placement will be an important factor to consider. No point going somewhere where the graduates are unemployed.

[dr_prephd]

Here's a link to the USNWR master's rankings:

http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/college/masters-south

[dale1]

I am somewhat surprised that no one has actually "named names" here.  For those in higher ed/student affairs, there are many good options.  I think it's a good idea to go to somewhere that has lots of options, and remember that HE/SA programs are not going to be at tiny institutions most often, because it's a discipline only offered at the graduate level.

Also, don't foreclose the option of working FT and going PT for the graduate program in student affairs.  Let's say your interest is community colleges.  Wouldn't it be great to work FT at one, take classes in the evenings at the local U that offers HE/SA program, and come out in three years with great experience AND the degree? 

Ok, in no particular order, my "top" programs:

Indiana University (has program at both Bloomington, the "mother ship" and Indianapolis, the "urban ship").  My MS and (eventually) PhD will be from IU-Bloomington
UC-Los Angeles
Colorado State U (good MS, no PhD program until recently)
U. Florida - Gainesville
Miami University - Oxford, OH
University of Michigan - Ann Arbor (got a few great faculty from Indiana U a few years ago)

[happy_camper101]

Other schools I've heard that have strong programs for HESA (no particular order)

Bowling Green State University
University of Maryland- College Park
University of Vermont
Iowa State University
Florida State University
Western Illinois University
Illinois State University
Oregon State University

[admithopeful09]

Thanks so much for the replies. I wonder, should I be worried that of the two lists posted by dale and happy camper, only 1 of the 7 schools I'm applying to is on them?

[happy_camper101]

everyone has their own selection criteria on what they look for in a school or program. you have good reasons to pick your 7 and i have my own reasons for mine. but, having said that, i am open to seeing what others pick just to be aware of the other programs out there....

so...why not check out the schools that dale and i listed and see how they compare to your schools--
it doesn't hurt for ANYONE to do more grad school searching and it might change your situation or not but either way---it's good to make sure that the schools you apply to are best ones for you...

since everyone doesn't have much money these days ---it is important that when you spend money, you spend it doing something worthwhile and going to a good school for 2 years is a something important for all of us.....happy searching..

[soprano]

You've gotten a lot of good advice here.  I would say to also consider the following:

1. What classes are offered and what classes are ACTUALLY being taught (and when)? You can be in for a rude awakening if the catalogue lists 20 classes, but 15 of them have not been taught for a while.

2. What exactly are your career goals?  How many professors and teachers are there in the department that share your interests?  How many of them are ACTUALLY physically there - teaching classes and interacting with students?  You'd be surprised at how many professors are on the department listing, but in actuality are permanently on loan somewhere else.  Don't get caught unaware - visit and talk with the professors that you are interested in possibly working with.

3. If you are looking for a non-academic career path - how many marketable skills are they actually teaching you?  And are those skills actually being used in the marketplace?  I know someone who was being studying design - yet her professors were teaching her ASP (NOT ASP.NET).  Who uses straight ASP anymore?  She wasn't taught about JSP, PhP or anything else marketable.  Don't let that happen to you - whatever the skills are that you need in your career field - make sure that you will be able to get them there.

4. How often does the department change their requirements?  Is it new?  A quick look at a couple of previous years catalogues can help you to know how stable the program is.

5. What happens to students after they leave?  Is it a very competitive program?  Not so much?  What is best for you and your well-being?  Some people thrive in competitive environments - others don't.  Know what is best for you.

When I select a school again for the next phase, I'm going to approach it as a consumer.  Look at it this way.  You are paying money (they might give you waivers maybe - and see how many of them there are - are they available for them during the first year?).  But ultimately, you are making the selection.  You should have the same type of "mindset" as you would when you are buying a house or a car or selecting a job.  Select the schools that fit you best and that have the best reputation.  Take the schools for "test drives" if you can - visit, talk to professors, talk to students, really dig for information, sit in on classes.  Can you fit there?  Would you be happy there?  Will you learn what you need to learn there?