next »

[allion]

Hi,
I am interested in relocating to Australia with my family. I am currently working as Assistant Professor at a renowned Regional University in the USA. I gather that an Assistant Professor (senior lecturer) is paid much more than what we earn in the USA. Moreover the amount of taxes that we have to bear from our salary is exorbitant. Any idea about income taxes in Australia? Any clue about the scale of salary of a senior lecturer in Design or Assosciate Professor in an Australian University.

Does anyone have any idea about a specific website to look for Graphic Design/Web Design/Interaction Design/Multimedia Design types of university jobs in Australia. I have an MFA in Design (Terminal Degree in the USA) and currently working on my PhD in Design in the US.
Any advise about seeking a faculty job in Australia!

Thank you

[figee]

Jobs in Australian universities are usually advertised on Wednesdays in the Australian newspaper, and on university websites.  Salaries vary according to university and location, but they are set by EBAs (agreements between the union and the university).  Thus you might be able to negotiate level you come in at and your duties, but your income will be non-negotiable.  We may get paid a little bit more than you guys, but cost of living needs to be taken into account.

Income tax:  Individual tax burden is the second highest in the OECD (as of 2006.  There have been recent changes and I don't know how that's changed things).  However, after payroll tax and social security, it drops down to the second lowest.  So get get hit up front, but not necessarily afterwards.  I'd think, though, that if you find the level of taxation in the States exorbitant, you may find Australia a bit of a shock.  For more info: http://comparativetaxation.treasury.gov.au/content/default.asp
Lots of numbers, and I don't understand all of them.

[pinkmouse]

Assistant Professor does not = 'Senior Lecturer' in Australia. Assistant Professor (in the US) would be the same as LECTURER, level A, at most. (Some Australian institutions have started using American terms, such as Assistant Prof). Senior Lecturer is like Associate Professor in the US.

Whether you would get a higher salary: depends on the job, and what you're getting now. In my field, pay in the US is typically higher than in Australia.

Taxes in Australia are higher than many US regions. Until recently, the top tax rate was 49%, and this kicked in only at 60k... This has been adjusted to be somewhat more reasonable, check www.ato.gov.au to see what your liabilities would be.
Also bear in mind the cost of living in Australian cities (especially Sydney) would be much higher than many US regions (imagine moving to San Francisco, for instance). Check out www.domain.com.au and see those house prices for areas you'd consider living.

Australia is a wonderful place to live. However I have seen a number of US-->AUS relocations fail, for a number of reasons. Often it's the trailing spouse & kids missing home too much (happens with relocations anywhere), but also the expectation that things were going to be cheaper or easier in Australia than in the US.

[allion]

I appreciate the kind information. I will have to really analyze every aspect before making a decision.
Thank you so much.

[cranefly]

I can't believe anybody thinks US income tax is "exorbitant". Honestly.

[figee]

I know!  That was the the thing that made me grin.

[easily_distracted]

As an Australian living in the US, I can assure you that Australians pay substantially more income tax and that EVERYTHING costs more so even though your gross salary may be similar, the amount of cash left over after taxes, rent/mortgage payments, groceries and gas (you won't believe how expensive gas is) will be minimal.

One of the previous posts was totally correct in that the cost of living will be very dependent on location as living in Sydney and Melbourne (and even Brisbane now to some degree) are VERY expensive places in terms of housing, groceries, gas etc.

You will also have to factor in the cost of traveling to and from the US for family visits etc - we are talking ~$3K for EACH PERSON. Never underestimate how far away my beloved home land is and just how expensive it costs to get there and back.

Pinkmouse is correct though in that Australia is a WONDERFUL place to live but being so isolated can have its drawbacks and the high standard of living comes at a cost.

In academic terms in Australia:
Associate Lecturer = Instructor/Lecturer
Lecturer = beginning Assistant Professor
Senior Lecturer = almost/recently tenured Associate Professor
Associate Professor = productive, senior Associate Professor
(Full) Professor = (Full) Professor

As a new PhD, you would be a lecturer or even associate lecturer depending on the university.

[abitatd]

As someone from the States who just left Australia to return to the States, I agree with all the comments.  Yes, pay is a bit better, but taxes are high - at my income level it was around 25% of my income. On top of which, I calculated that transferring money between Australia and the US to pay bills (student loans, credit cards, etc.) cost me another 5 - 10% (bank fees, exchange fees, and exchange rate) and travel (public transport in Sydney + flights home for conferences and holidays) was another 3-5K per year. And I was flying on my lonesome. Esentially, I was losing about 40% of my income on things I couldn't control. And keep in mind, you are still expected to pay taxes in the US - I didn't have to actually pay any money, but the process and forms involved took me 2 months to figure out.

I can't comment much on the quality of primary/secondary schools, but I do know the private ones are expensive, and depending on the area the public ones can be questionable. Think New Orleans before Katrina. And childcare for those not old enough for school usually includes a waiting list and high fees (my colleagues and students will attest this this - one student who became pregnant put her yet to be born child on the waiting list at the 3.5-month mark - it took 17 months for her child, at that point 10.5 months old, to get a place at the childcare center she wanted/trusted).

Prices for everything in Sydney (where I was) were high, and still going up when I left. The never-ending drought in the agricultural areas has caused the prices of everything to increase. And Australia imports very little in the way of fresh anything due to an understandable fear of importing something that will destroy most things agricultural, so if it doesn't exist or gets destroyed by the weather the cost will increase exponentially.

This is not to stay living there wasn't great - but you've got a lot to think about, and we (as a forum) have only scraped the surface. Halloween exists, but doesn't exist; Thanksgiving is known, but not celebrated and is not a holiday, neither is July 4. Some American foods don't exist (Fritos and grits, how I missed those), and although some of these may be available through certian importers, the cost was absurdly ridiculous.

The important thing is to consider these things, and then if you are seriously interested, take the family on a 2-4 week vacation. Spend one week being tourists and spend at least a week living in a suburb, commuting to where you would work, where the kids might go to school, shopping at the local stores, etc. Do this is real-time (get to work by nine, and you pay extra if you drop the kids off early or pick them up late). I mention this because transportation in Sydney (no matter how you travel) is horrid. Go shopping for electronics (not much of your current stuff will work), and home furnishings, and homewares (you're not going to want to ship most of this - I can say my 46 boxes (it all fit in the 12' UHaul trailer) of stuff cost just over $11k to ship to the States). You might be shocked by the prices (especially if you think taxes in the US are high), I know I was.

Again, I don't mean to be negative, but relate my experiences. I'm glad I took the chance and moved to Australia and taught and researched in the University system. I learned so much, and it has made me a better assistant professor (lecturer level B!!!) and researcher, but I am also happy to be back in the States. I am also single, and didn't have other persons to consider. If you want to PM me, I'd be happy to answer any other questions you might have.

[pinkmouse]

Thanks for sharing tiggeratc. Your comment here rang particularly true from what I have observed:

This is not to stay living there wasn't great - but you've got a lot to think about, and we (as a forum) have only scraped the surface. Halloween exists, but doesn't exist; Thanksgiving is known, but not celebrated and is not a holiday, neither is July 4. Some American foods don't exist (Fritos and grits, how I missed those), and although some of these may be available through certian importers, the cost was absurdly ridiculous.

I don't mean this as a criticism directed at you, tigger, but I have seen that Americans moving to Australia (and the UK to some extent), have some expectation (hope?) that such things (Thanksgving, 4th July), *would* be celebrated in their new home. Perhaps because Australia is an English-speaking country, there is some mistaken assumption that it will be 'just like home'. These are relatively small cultural issues, but they seem to loom large for a lot of Americans I have met (however, ask an Australian who has moved to the States whether they mind Australia Day or Anzac Day not being celebrated there: they not only won't care, but would be mystified by the suggestion that their country's specific national events should be celebrated overseas).
In a supermarket in Sydney, in November, I saw two American girls buying a turkey (ok, easy to get), then asking the sales assistant where the canned pumpkin was for pies. (I nearly p*ssed myself laughing). But this expectation of being able to buy the same things, essentially live the SAME LIFE as at home, while in a foreign country, seems particular to Americans.

[easily_distracted]

I don't mean this as a criticism directed at you, tigger, but I have seen that Americans moving to Australia (and the UK to some extent), have some expectation (hope?) that such things (Thanksgving, 4th July), *would* be celebrated in their new home. Perhaps because Australia is an English-speaking country, there is some mistaken assumption that it will be 'just like home'. These are relatively small cultural issues, but they seem to loom large for a lot of Americans I have met (however, ask an Australian who has moved to the States whether they mind Australia Day or Anzac Day not being celebrated there: they not only won't care, but would be mystified by the suggestion that their country's specific national events should be celebrated overseas).
In a supermarket in Sydney, in November, I saw two American girls buying a turkey (ok, easy to get), then asking the sales assistant where the canned pumpkin was for pies. (I nearly p*ssed myself laughing). But this expectation of being able to buy the same things, essentially live the SAME LIFE as at home, while in a foreign country, seems particular to Americans.

Very true pinkmouse. Most of my American friends don't comprehend why Australia Day isn't celebrated on the 4th July and why we don't have a Thanksgiving Day. And while most grocery items are similar between the two countries, there are specific items that one can't buy routinely ... try finding Vegemite or WeetBix (NOT the English Weetabix) at the supermarket here ... so Americans moving to Australia should expect the same. By and large, Australia is very similar to the US but it still retains a mostly English culture (something most Americans just can't understand).

As with any international relocation, one should be prepared to accept that their new location is NOT going to be exactly the same as home, adjust accordingly and celebrate new experiences (I LOVE Thanksgiving if not just for all of the food!).  You haven't truly experienced a REAL Christmas until you have seen Santa sweating like a pig under a blazing hot December sun surrounded by fake snow and spent Christmas lunch in the backyard pool or at the beach!

And just a quick comment on the public schools in Australia - they are overwhelmingly good and provide quality education. As with every country, there are low socioeconomic areas (particularly in the larger cities) where the facilities and quality/behaviour of students may be questionable but the quality of teaching is still good. As an assistant professor with a PhD who was solely educated in the public sector in Australia (including university), I will always defend our public education system :)

The childcare situation however is abysmal.

uxk8396: if moving to Australia is something you are seriously considering, tiggeratc is correct in that taking a vacation there would be advisable, particularly if you have never visited Australia before.  The lifestyle is considerably more laid back than the US and that is one reason that a lot of people find it an attractive place. Yes, you will undoubtedly be worse off financially with salary, living expenses, travel etc, but a lot of people are willing to forgo the cash because of the lifestyle.  Keep in mind also that there are other places in Australia OTHER than Sydney - if you're looking to live in a city, there's also Melbourne, Brisbane, Adelaide, Canberra and Perth as well as smaller cities (Hobart, Darwin, Cairns) and regional areas. Just don't underestimate how far away it is from the US.

[figee]

I don't mean this as a criticism directed at you, tigger, but I have seen that Americans moving to Australia (and the UK to some extent), have some expectation (hope?) that such things (Thanksgving, 4th July), *would* be celebrated in their new home. Perhaps because Australia is an English-speaking country, there is some mistaken assumption that it will be 'just like home'. These are relatively small cultural issues, but they seem to loom large for a lot of Americans I have met (however, ask an Australian who has moved to the States whether they mind Australia Day or Anzac Day not being celebrated there: they not only won't care, but would be mystified by the suggestion that their country's specific national events should be celebrated overseas).

Very true pinkmouse. Most of my American friends don't comprehend why Australia Day isn't celebrated on the 4th July and why we don't have a Thanksgiving Day. And while most grocery items are similar between the two countries, there are specific items that one can't buy routinely ... try finding Vegemite or WeetBix (NOT the English Weetabix) at the supermarket here ... so Americans moving to Australia should expect the same. By and large, Australia is very similar to the US but it still retains a mostly English culture (something most Americans just can't understand).

And just a quick comment on the public schools in Australia - they are overwhelmingly good and provide quality education. As with every country, there are low socioeconomic areas (particularly in the larger cities) where the facilities and quality/behaviour of students may be questionable but the quality of teaching is still good. As an assistant professor with a PhD who was solely educated in the public sector in Australia (including university), I will always defend our public education system :)

The childcare situation however is abysmal.

I see that other people have leapt in here on exactly the same points I was going to make.... so this post is a little bit pointless.  I do think that comparing Australian, or even most Sydney ublic schools to pre-Katrina New Orleans was a bit OTT.  Yes, in some places, they are bad, but in most they're pretty good. 

Other things to think about  In Australia, cities tend to be very suburban.  There is no 'downtown', and instead intellectutal life tends to be clustered in little 'villages' around the city centre.  Yes, fresh fruit and veg can be expensive (and so can milk).  But the quality tends to be good.

I think that living here is great, but I'm happy here - it's home.  But it is a different society, and I think that people who move here sometimes do expect things to be replicated as they are at home.  And there's nothing that annoys Australians more than that.

[abitatd]

I don't mind the criticism - it is constructive and you're being honest. I moved to Australia knowing things would not be the same as the US, but it didn't help much when I went to interview there was a Domino's, KFC, and McDonald's across the street from where I was staying, and a Baskin Robbins and Pizza Hut just up the block. And most of the shows on TV were from the US. I spent my first six months thinking of Australia as America Lite (and yes, I know that's a horrible thing to say, but I'm also also from Texas so I have the double-whammy of superiority complexes :p )

I did know that Thanksgiving and July 4th wouldn't be celebrated (nor did I expect them to be), but relative to uxk8396 and his family (i.e., kids) this might be a factor to consider. These were my two favorite holidays growing up - and they still are.

And I did not mean to downplay the public education system in Australia. Being in Sydney, and having friends/colleagues in many different suburbs - along with students from many others, I did get a variety of reads on the public education system. There are (like NOLA) some great public schools, there are also some not so great ones. The media tends to focus on the not so good ones most of the time. Pardon my falling into that sterotyping mudpuddle. Most of my best (and favorite) students came from the public education system. Sometimes, we just need the reminder.

I will retract my comparing Australian schools (which I didn't mean to do - I originally meant only the Sydney schools, but still) to the NOLA system. That was a bit extreme - maybe Louisiana overall. The US and Australian systems are very similar - there are good and bad in both. However, there are some fundamental differences I am still trying figure out - the HSC for example.

Again, most of my thoughts as far as food and holidays were just things I noticed, but learned to live with - small children adapt, but not without complaints usually (same goes for partners as far as that goes). Which for me meant I would whinge about it and then try to move on, but when the whinging is multiplied by two or three (or more) - it can be a bit harder. Especially because finding others to share experiences with isn't always easy.

Like I said, I'm glad I did it, but I wish I had gotten this sort of information from the forum before I left, I might have been more prepared for some of the unexpected things. I also wouldn't have spent most of my visit between the beach and the University. Although I did visit the grocery store, (I do love and miss Nudies), I didn't check on prices of the other stuff I mentioned - those were truly shocking to me. Which is why I suggest the week-long non-tourist style visit. A trip to the movies was shocking  - what's with no prices on anything at the concession stand??? Me, popcorn, and a drink was $30. I almost dropped my popcorn. So a family trip to see the latest Disney flick might break the bank for a young family.

Just my thoughts again, though. I am planning on leading a month-long study abroad group to Australia in 2010 to broaden some minds about the Australian culture. Which is one idea for someone interested in moving down to explore the country before committing to it. I would also recommend taking a sabattical or finding a worthwhile conference and/or collaboration and using those as an entryway to the country for few weeks.

Again, just my thoughts.

[allion]

Hi,
I just came back from Sydney last week. I was amazed by the cultural diversity in terms of food and people. Things are relatively expensive, but we do get variety of food products that are sold in Europe too. Bondi Beach was great, as well as the wharf at Opera House. I could sense that they are laid back. For instance, in the USA, you will get free wireless Internet in a simple Motel 6, while in Sydney or Australia, it is still expensive.

If you were offered a faculty position in Sydney and the salary scale would be between AUD 85-95k annually, while here in the US you were earning in the 50k (before tax) for the same type of job descriptins. What would you do? I am in the same dilemma. I am not sure how much after tax, the gross income will be, with my wife and two kids as dependents. Any guess. Thank you for sharing your experiences.

Take care,
Uxk

[easily_distracted]

If you were offered a faculty position in Sydney and the salary scale would be between AUD 85-95k annually, while here in the US you were earning in the 50k (before tax) for the same type of job descriptins. What would you do? I am in the same dilemma. I am not sure how much after tax, the gross income will be, with my wife and two kids as dependents. Any guess. Thank you for sharing your experiences.

I'm not sure that a lecturer (or even a senior lecturer on the lower end of the scale) would be getting AUD$85-95k in gross salary alone. You need to be aware that Australian positions are often advertised with "salary packages" and that these figures typically include the mandatory superannuation contribution that the employer pays (9%), holiday loading (17.5% bonus pay for vacation time) and any extras/bonuses that come with the job (car allowances etc).  When you deduct these from the gross salary indicated and take into account the ~40% income tax, your take home salary will be substantially less than it looks. 

[highway61]

I'm an American who's been in Australia about ten years, now in Sydney. A few pointers: a lectureship here pays 17.5% superannuation (not the government-mandated 9% as the last poster said). That's a huge plus for anyone who might stick around! And while some costs are exorbitant, others aren't. We don't have the big health-care costs here that we did in the US for instance.

Re travel and research support, A lot also would depend on what university you're joining, what department, etc. In my new position I've been able to manage support for lots of travel overseas and within Australia, which lessens the amount out-of-pocket I'd have spent (and did spend in my last job at a university without as deep pockets though still a research-intensive one).

My one other tip concerns the levels of lecturing: yes, A=lecturer US, B=Assistant Prof., C (Sr Lecturer)=Assoc Prof. So far so good. But I'd say D (Assoc Prof here) = Professor US, with E (Professor here) = chaired, endowed professorship in the US.

Remember too that the tenure system here is much different for better (mostly!) or worse. Once you're hired into a "tenurable" or "permanent" position (nearly everything B and above is this; A is usually a 3-year non-renewable contract), you're in. It's almost impossible to be let go at that stage (and I know of situations where departments rue the hires they made into that position). The great thing is, you can just get on with your work and read all the Chronicle First-Person columns about the tenure clock with smug detachment.

Overall I love it here! Quality of life is ridiculously high on most fronts; the negative bits are ones you'd find in some form everywhere.