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[smart_e_pantz]

I'd go to the dean, the chair, and the financial aid people and demand a refund and then withdraw.  The class is out of control and the ineffectual professor is not worth the salary she is being paid.  The situation OP describes [...] is completely unacceptable. 

Let's keep this in perspective. The situation the OP describes is chattering students. Not nuclear warheads being detonated on the premises.

Once, there was an incident. Once, the OP tried to take a stand and was shot down. In response, the OP caused a scene.

For all we know, the professor - at 70 years old - may be taking the position that many on these fora have taken (and been congratulated for taking, let's not forget), and is simply not going to babysit a bunch of kids. I've heard a number of forumites make similar statements, and rarely does anyone suggest that they should be reprimanded for it.

And who knows? The professor may intend to give the class a stern talking to in the next class session.

This whole business of multiple complaints and demands for a refund sound a little over-the-top to me. The student had a (very short) argument with another student, which the professor may not have even noticed. It's entirely possible that she had no idea what the hell he was going on about as he stormed out of the class.

Most on the fora would only advocate this position if there was no real interference with someone else's ability to learn.  At the point that interference occurs, snowflake needs to be melted down and the only one with presumed authority to do it is the prof.

[anthroid]

And, in point of fact, I have never, ever made a representation on these fora that I would tolerate this kind of student behavior in my classroom.  Students will not act like the idiots OP has described in my classroom.  Period.  They never have and they never will.  Perhaps some forumites would be comfortable leaving classroom deportment issues for students to solve, but that was a solution often foisted on me in my Catholic grade school years, and I always despised it.  Always.  The person in authority ought to be in authority and reward those behaving well while punishing those who do not.  The person in authority ought to respect herself and her discipline and her role as a paid professor and shut down counterproductive noise.  The students can have as much attitude as they like.  They must act well, however, even if that act comes with a side of resentment.

Look, if this was going on in the classroom of one of my professors, I would want to know about it as chair so I could help the professor actually teach the course to the students, like the OP, who want to learn something.  The laissez-faire attitude to classroom management, like the laissez-faire attitude to the economy, is a recipe for disaster.

[grasshopper]

And, in point of fact, I have never, ever made a representation on these fora that I would tolerate this kind of student behavior in my classroom. 

I don't think anyone suggested that you have, or that you would.

Nor that, as chair, you would tolerate it in the professors under you, either.

[spork]

[. . .]

Prof: “Thank you and I appreciate that. But, don’t worry about it. I honestly don’t know how to handle situations like this. I am embarrassed that I would even have to tell a student to behave in a way that should be inherent to them in the first place. I have always depended on other students in the class to handle things like this.”


[. . .]

I did some sniffing around and found out that the reason students take her courses is because she is known to be a shoe-in for an A and she has a reputation for being “easy”. That explains a lot about the type of students in my class I have with her.

[. . .]

This person should not be teaching at the college level.

[kedves]

This person should not be teaching at the college level.

Right.  I think we all agree on that.  (Actually, her classroom would probably be even more out of control if she were teaching at the high school level.)  The thing is, she is teaching.  I had very similar experiences with some professors as an undergrad many years ago and TA-ing for a different set of professors more recently.  Like it or not, there are many bad professors out there.

[anthroid]

And, in point of fact, I have never, ever made a representation on these fora that I would tolerate this kind of student behavior in my classroom. 

I don't think anyone suggested that you have, or that you would.

Nor that, as chair, you would tolerate it in the professors under you, either.

No, you're right.  But, Grassy, my friend, you said upthread that "a number of forumites" don't seem to care about classroom deportment:

For all we know, the professor - at 70 years old - may be taking the position that many on these fora have taken (and been congratulated for taking, let's not forget), and is simply not going to babysit a bunch of kids. I've heard a number of forumites make similar statements, and rarely does anyone suggest that they should be reprimanded for it.

I don't know to what specific number you refer, but my sense of our colleagues on this forum is that most of us would not tolerate this nonsense (including, if I may be so bold, you).  Assuming that the OP is on target in hu's discussion of the classroom dynamics, and that includes many instances of out-of-control students, this OP is absolutely correct in being upset and in expecting hu's professor to actually be in charge of the classroom.  Again, this doesn't happen in my classroom, and I would be quick to help my faculty members who have trouble maintaining a civil classroom.  OP is not out of line for expecting a civil classroom, though, as hu has acknowledged, there are better and worse ways to get to that place.  Professor has said, in essence, that nothing will change.  OP is entitled to take this further if so desired.

And, OP, just FYI:  it's a "shoo-in," not a "shoe-in." 

[grasshopper]

I don't know to what specific number you refer, but my sense of our colleagues on this forum is that most of us would not tolerate this nonsense (including, if I may be so bold, you). 

No boldness required. I've said so myself, and on this very thread.

However, I can't count the number of times I've heard forumites say things to the effect of "I'm not a babysitter."

Assuming that the OP is on target in hu's discussion of the classroom dynamics, and that includes many instances of out-of-control students, this OP is absolutely correct in being upset and in expecting hu's professor to actually be in charge of the classroom. 

I don't doubt but that the OP is giving a faithful rendition of events. But I think that you are taking that faithful rendition, and assuming some zoo-like atmosphere where all hell is breaking loose.

There was consistent chattering.
Some students came in late.
Some students left mid-lecture.
The end.

Then, one day - and on one day alone - there was a big, albeit short, brouhaha, caused in part by the OP himself.

This is not grounds for dismissal.

And I suspect that if a student marched into your office and started complaining about the way a professor manages her classroom, you'd have some questions about how much, how often, and why. I also suspect that there would be a big binder of some colour or another. I don't think your first piece of advice would be to tell him to march his butt up to the deans office, file an official complaint, and demand a refund - which is what you suggested this student do.

I would be quick to help my faculty members who have trouble maintaining a civil classroom.

Help is one thing. Especially if a 70 year old, likely tenured, professor who has probably been doing this for longer than you've been alive requests your help. But demanding a professional review based on the comments of one student, who wrote his comments while admittedly still upset over not only the situation, but his own reaction to it? That's a whole other thing.

Professor has said, in essence, that nothing will change.  OP is entitled to take this further if so desired.

And here we're in agreement. Thankfully, the OP did not take your advice, and decided that instead of overreacting again, he would speak to the professor herself to see what could be done. It's entirely possible - and hopefully so - that nothing need be done, now that the worst offender has dropped the course. But if that's not the case, the OP now has some idea of what his next course of action could be.