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[magistra]

You know, people, if this were, say, in the Online Teaching boards where it belongs, you might get more response....

As always, the devil's in the details.  Some classes lend themselves to on-line learning, some less so.  Some teachers love it, some don't get it.  Some admins do see them as cash cows, or can't see the different needs, some accept them on their own terms.  Sometimes mass amounts of students are allowed to enroll, and one teacher can't handle that.  Lots of feedback is essential, and that level of attention can be wearying, as can the feeling that you need to be available 24/7 (you don't).  A common complaint by students -- justifiably -- is that they don't know what's expected of them and where there grade is coming from, and the lack of constant contact compounds this.

Hybrid courses may also be in-class part time and on-line part time.  Lots of ways to work this.

On-line courses are becoming increasingly popular in high schools -- Florida Virtual is one such -- and they can be a boon to students who can't take certain classes at their own school, homeschoolers, those with special needs, etc.  I think it will become far more popular, and a good program ensures that students learn well, and have plenty of structure and help as needed.  I'm familiar with FVHS and it looks pretty good.

One downside, however, and it's something we see in textbooks too, is that there's this idea students need lots of colors, graphics, big fonts, little games, and other nonsense in order to learn.  Frankly, I find it incredibly distracting.  I tried one on-line exercise that had a huge ticking timer attached.  I could have easily done the exercise in seconds, except that the timer was so distracting I couldn't concentrate.  Yes, you could turn off the volume, but you still get the moving hand.  And what was the point?  I'd love to ask hs students what they think of some of this -- I suspect they find the constant barrage of images, bright colors (no text in black, heaven forfend!) and little snippets of information to be patronizing, too.  The courses I've seen tend to be for grades 7-12, though, so that may affect their presentation.

[balancing_act]

I only took one online class as an undergraduate and it was a fabulous experience. It was a Mythology class in the English department. But, I have the feeling that many online courses aren't set up the way mine was. First, it was through Blackboard, so finding assignments and messages was a snap. (I've seen the awful Web CT sites and they look rather confusing-- unless that is up to the creator). Second, the prof had done the course several times.

I took the class in the summer, read 5 books, wrote 3 papers, had to regularly submit several detailed questions on professor's "lecture notes" and of the books, most of which he answered.

I think he put a lot of time into the course, as did I. I think that some students take online courses because they think it will be easier, or they have to invest less time to succeed. Perhaps this is some of the problem with both professor and student satisfaction rates.

[infopri]

If your essays are written in the way your post was--as a single run-on sentence without a single punctuation mark, other than a comma where the final period should be--then I can assure you that those essays aren't gong to be very persuasive.  And, given that you've entered a community of college professors, no one is likely to buy your ghost papers.  In fact, if we catch any of our students buying your wares, they will be in big doo-doo.

Please take your spam with you when you leave.

[der_gadfly]

The issue of the difference in quality of the learning experience is far to complex to measure based solely on inputs, or outputs. The variable that is most difficult to assess is the student. We can say that good online instruction means a professor responds within 48 hours to every email. So, when this happens, we say it is good (just a single example of the performance metrics used in so many places). Some think it is good when it has all sorts of cool multimedia thing-a-ma-bobs combined with a caliope-like sound produced by all the cool bells and whistles.

it is NOT easy to port an existing course online. The administrators who push it as the salvation of their budgets are more often wrong than right. Schools that enter into this arena with the intention of improving profits and builing enrollment sizes are equally deluded.

The best online courses I have seen are those that have been built by passionate faculty, usually as an outgrowth of their own classroom experiences, and which sprang forth from a traditional course with online support.

I am ignoring the spammers here, plus the highly uninformed one who thinks that the research literature says it is no good: ill-informed and probably unable to prepare a proper research study on Hus own. In other words, more or less agreeing with larry on this one.

[jvano123]

I think online learning certainly has its place for individuals from distant locales and full-time workers. However, the full-immersion of brick and mortar may be necessary for a complete educational experience. The combination of both worlds may make a more well-rounded scholar, able to navigate in both worlds, socially adept in settings other than online, and tech savvy.

In regards to loading up of class sizes, I think there is quite a bit of research out there that shows that online classes take more time and effort for faculty to administer. If faculty are having problems, cite research and show the higher-ups the data. I would think that quality should be first for any educational institution.....but maybe I am wrong.

[der_gadfly]

I think online learning certainly has its place for individuals from distant locales and full-time workers. However, the full-immersion of brick and mortar may be necessary for a complete educational experience. The combination of both worlds may make a more well-rounded scholar, able to navigate in both worlds, socially adept in settings other than online, and tech savvy.

So I have to go to class to get the 'complete experience' even though all I give a carp about is getting the degree and getting on with my life, all because I live close by or do not work. My peers who live far away or work get to laze away doing their coursework at a time of their own choosing?

<stomps feet repeatedly - "It's not Fair!">

[jvano123]

Depends on how you look at it and what you are after. I think both worlds (online and brick and mortar) may be necessary...maybe. Regarding "lazing away in an educational experience", that is an individual choice and a sorry one at that. You make it what it becomes..no one else is responsible but you, no one else gets the learning but you (with the excepotion of thse who you come in contact with during your educational journey?)

Positive viewpoints and actions produce positive, more productive experiences.

[duchess_of_malfi]

Positive viewpoints and actions produce positive, more productive experiences.

Not if you're building a bridge--or a space shuttle.  This sort of nonsense makes my angry.

[garrito]

I don't think there is a really big concern. Certain people will always prefer face to face learning and most of college is about the experience. There's not much of an experience with college if you take your classes online.

Obviously online classes work really well for some people but the majority I would say want to GO to college.

[infopri]

Why go to college at all, when you can stay home and play video games? 

Reported.

[lindasimth]

face to face learning may more convenient and when the students have some questiones,they can ask teachers quickly,but onling learning is the way which should be tested.Is that can help our children learning?I doubt it.

[polly_mer]

face to face learning may more convenient and when the students have some questiones,they can ask teachers quickly,but onling learning is the way which should be tested.Is that can help our children learning?I doubt it.

Linda,

If that post is any kind of indication of what an online class with you would be like, then I think the answer in your case is a definite "face-to-face only".

I teach partially online and one of the biggest hurdles for my students is the fact that they have such poor reading and writing skills that no learning can occur.  They have to get themselves into a face-to-face situation to fix their language skills before a primarily written medium will work.

[jvano123]

So.....where we are going with this is that online learning MAY not work for ESL students and others that could have difficulties with the English (or other) language. I have not had any experience teaching online. However I do think that the online student needs to be a skilled and motivated learner capable of planning and completing assignments on-time. In addition, higher education,online classes are more difficult because the learner must be a competent writer capable of reviewing his/her own papers prior to submission. I have found that trying to reserve time (online) with a proofreader is difficult because of time zone differences amongst other things. 

[polly_mer]

Jvano123,

Check out this site with particular attention paid to the qualities of successful online students.

Many of the things you have listed are on there along with a few other key items that are often overlooked in these conversations.

[infopri]

In addition, higher education,online classes are more difficult because the learner must be a competent writer capable of reviewing his/her own papers prior to submission. I have found that trying to reserve time (online) with a proofreader is difficult because of time zone differences amongst other things. 

I don't see how this need (boldfaced) is any different for online vs. face-to-face students.  And online students don't necessarily have to find an online proofreader.  There's no reason they can't look for one in their respective local communities, just as they use their own local libraries, etc.