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[captainwillard]

Start documenting.

Work with HR.  In particular, get HR to make a mandatory referral to counseling through the EAP.  If she won't go, she can be fired.

LarryC is right.  Ultimately she'll have to go.  This behavior is completely unprofessional and unacceptable and it's gone on for far too long.

I'm grateful that I don't have a situation like this one to deal with (yet) and also for the opportunity to learn about dealing with such things.  In this case, is it OK to go to HR without the dean's blessing?  Would I ask for permission, or just let the dean know I'm going to talk to the HR director, or just go talk to HR and tell the dean later if the dean asks or it comes up in conversation?  Hope that's on-topic; never want to hijack!

[zharkov]

Start documenting.

Work with HR.  In particular, get HR to make a mandatory referral to counseling through the EAP.  If she won't go, she can be fired.

LarryC is right.  Ultimately she'll have to go.  This behavior is completely unprofessional and unacceptable and it's gone on for far too long.

I'm grateful that I don't have a situation like this one to deal with (yet) and also for the opportunity to learn about dealing with such things.  In this case, is it OK to go to HR without the dean's blessing?  Would I ask for permission, or just let the dean know I'm going to talk to the HR director, or just go talk to HR and tell the dean later if the dean asks or it comes up in conversation?  Hope that's on-topic; never want to hijack!

I think that one can safely meet with an HR manager or director to discuss the options available and the process for dealing with such a problem.  You would need the dean to be involved if you actively want to begin the termination process, say.

[doctor_philosophiae]

Is there a possibility that this individual suffers from bipolar disorder, rather than mere depression?

I really think that you should consider the possibility that she is ill, and could do with help -- i.e. proper medication and/or psychological help -- rather than being fired. She has been open and honest with you about the fact that she was on medication, yet you seem intent on using this information against her.

[mssdoc]

Read all of my posts.  So at what point did I say we wanted to fire her? Never, never, never.  I said we wanted to improve the situation.  But at the risk of rehashing everything I have said, I was asking to advice on how to handle the situation.  If you check some posts back, you will see that I believe she may, in fact, have some mental illness.  Nowhere in that post do you see me suggesting she be fired.

But what more would you suggest we do?  She's been spoken to about counseling; she may even have gone, but it apparently has not helped. (Please note that I understand it may take many, many years, changing therapists or counselors many times.  Let's not go down that sidetrack.)  She's got a prescription for medication; she has stopped taking it.   She says she is physically unable to perform at least 30% of her job duties; yet she will not consider a reassignment. Her supervisor has spoken to her about screaming at students; she bursts into tears in his office, then apparently ignores his advice.  You tell me, if you were called into your boss' office to talk about your performance, don't you think you'd be taking note?

At exactly which point does her behavior begin to outweigh her contribution?

[sockgumbee]

MSSdoc,

You are doing a remarkable job of dealing with this situation. I'd be curious how things do all fall out. Please let us know if it's not too painful.

I've had to fire two people who were not doing their job. I just told them what the job entailed and gave them a couple of days to decide if they would do the job the way it need to be done. Both tried to bargain with me, which pretty much decided things, since there was no room to bargain. Both were doing crazy things--but different crazy than your Tech. If the Tech is bursting into tears when talked to about her bad behavior . . . sounds like she's being manipulative--coping poor, poor pitiful me. Now I'm on the "she's got to go" bandwagon with LarryC and Anthroid. Although I still contend that you have to let her decide: if she's unwilling to change then she's out of a job.

It's too bad Doctor Philosophiae didn't do their homework and READ your previous posts closely, if at all.

[_touchedbyanoodle_]

Hey! Whoa! Nobody is saying what I'm thinking!

MSSdoc,
Are you sure, I mean absolutely sure, that you can afford to fight this battle? You're not setting any bridges on fire? Stirring up no hornet's nests? Her own supervisor hasn't done anything about her, and you should figure out why. Acting without the dean's "blessing" could be very, very bad. Is there a way you can get those in a position of authority on board without going over (around?) their heads to HR? The severity of the woman's incompetence shouldn't prevent you from CYA!

I do think it is important to tread carefully, especially since you will basically be undermining decisions made by those currently in authority over you.

[mssdoc]

I'm not doing anything!  That's the entire point of this thread, I think.  I am absolutely clear that the Department Chair is NOT her supervisor; I can do nothing to act against her on my own. 

Perhaps I should make myself more clear:  What do I say to the Dean to make him understand the gravity of the situation?  And, for the possible end game scenario:  does anyone have any suggestions about how to deal with her when the Dean does nothing, and this behavior continues?

Sorry about the snark, here.  But you can see what this has brought up:  The Chair is "unofficially" in charge of staff in the department, and gets it when it isn't working.  But the Chair can do nothing about a situation that everyone, including the Dean, realizes is a problem.  So when the Chair waits for the Dean to do something, things downgrade.  What's a person to do? 

[_touchedbyanoodle_]

Saying something to the dean is doing something. Don't kid yourself.

[asterix]

What's a person to do? 

In addition to what others have mentioned (try to find help for her, try to get rid of her), a pragmatic solution favored by managers at places with strong unions is to get her promoted...to another department.  Perhaps the Dean's office could use some help?

[skeptic]

Okay--

You're having a problem with a staff member in your department.  In what you describe as a small, close-knit department, everybody knows ("all faculty have had experiences with...") what a problem this person has caused for the past ten years, although you yourself only caught onto it this past November, somehow.

No one else can deal with this but you, except that unfortunately it isn't your job, it's the dean's.  Except the dean is spineless, as was the part-time person who previously was in a position to deal with the situation--and the previous chair, when not busy napping at work, was too busy showing favoritism toward this particular employee to do anything about it.  Too bad for you, everyone around you is corrupt or incompetent, and you're going to have to take care of it yourself.

Though loathe to "go into the details," the best solution now seems to be to publish a detailed rant about the situation in a public online forum, with several identifying details that--of course--will not be recognizable to anyone involved in the actual situation who might happen to read it.  For example, it's important to broadcast publicly that this individual not only cries and slams doors at work, but may or may not be taking her depression meds.  Oh, and also, you let slip--damn typos!--that "hu" is actually a "she," and one of the issues is her ability to conduct the physical work of the job; another is her tendency to claim gender discrimination.  Not that you have any issues with having a female in this position, not you!

To those who respond online with suggestions, you have little but defensiveness and frustration to offer, at least if they don't say exactly what you want to hear.

From what you've written in several lengthy postings, I don't feel confident I have an accurate view of the situation, but I do believe I have several insights about your own temperament and degree of professionalism.  Is it just possible that part of the problem here is you?

[mssdoc]

The department I am in is physically separated from the person in question; I teach in a completely different location, and have not been chair for all ten years she has worked here. And I said the Tech got away with the behavior for "many" years, not ten.  But you are right, I (as well as others) should have taken the behavior more seriously.  The Tech's behavior has recently escalated, and I just assumed it was only occasional.  The new faculty,a s well as others who work closely with her, have recently informed me it is not.

And, although I did not mean to imply "everyone" was corrupt or incompetent", I can see where you may have seen that.  I will also note that others have tried to help this individual, as well as the new person.  The main reason I'm trying is because people are coming to me (especially the newbie instructor who mainly works with her). And I have already acknowledge that I do not think I do it very well.  That is why I asked.

And as for the frustration, well, yes, I am frustrated.  I'd love to have a department that runs more smoothly, and does not frustrate the people who work in it (BOTH the faculty, the students, and the Techs).  I have been listening, and absorbing the advice.  Just because I haven't said "what we are going to do is this:" does not mean we haven't discussed it with/in faculty meetings.

As for "being able to see themselves in the post."  You have no knowledge of our faculty/staff, and whether or not they read the fora.  Nor, admittedly, do I.  If I have offended anyone with my frustration, I sincerely apologize.

[zharkov]

Let me add an additional thought....

All complaints about a co-worker need to be communicated to the person's supervisor. (Other than addressing them first with the person.....)

If someone complains about the Tech, then that person must call the dean.  Maybe, OP, you need to get out of the role of being the conduit.

Another approach is making the Tech report to someone other than the dean. Maybe the chair?  Who do all the other techs work for? 

[doctor_philosophiae]

Read my post. At what point did I say that _you_ wanted to fire her?

As to your second rhetorical question, I suspect that she has taken note. Changing some of her behaviour may, literally, be almost beyond her control.

I live with someone who is mentally ill, and regularly suffer personal abuse, so it's possible that I have some insight.

As to your final rhetorical question, you sound rather like a utilitarian. You also seem remarkably hostile to those trying to help you.

Read all of my posts.  So at what point did I say we wanted to fire her? Never, never, never.  I said we wanted to improve the situation.  But at the risk of rehashing everything I have said, I was asking to advice on how to handle the situation.  If you check some posts back, you will see that I believe she may, in fact, have some mental illness.  Nowhere in that post do you see me suggesting she be fired.

But what more would you suggest we do?  She's been spoken to about counseling; she may even have gone, but it apparently has not helped. (Please note that I understand it may take many, many years, changing therapists or counselors many times.  Let's not go down that sidetrack.)  She's got a prescription for medication; she has stopped taking it.   She says she is physically unable to perform at least 30% of her job duties; yet she will not consider a reassignment. Her supervisor has spoken to her about screaming at students; she bursts into tears in his office, then apparently ignores his advice.  You tell me, if you were called into your boss' office to talk about your performance, don't you think you'd be taking note?

At exactly which point does her behavior begin to outweigh her contribution?

[sockgumbee]

I talked to a friend earlier today who had a similar employee to Tech. The employee used to report to my friend. Said employee (SE) was unhappy that her boss left, whom my friend replaced, and now can't get away with murder. SE took to crying jags about the change. My friend told her not to come to work anymore until she could get her self together because her behavior was so disruptive. SE got counseling and antidepressants. My friend said that SE is a stubborn person who operated as "the good wife" for the old boss who had a bad marriage. SE listened to old boss's stories, was tolerant of his bad work habits and basically made it easy for old boss to do what he wanted. In return SE got to do what SE wanted which was very little work. Anyway, now that SE is no longer my friend's problem it will be interesting to see how things will pan out as SE is still part of the organization. Also my friend actually likes SE personally but hates working with her.

If Tech is mentally ill to the point that others imagine, coming to the work situation which is stressing them out does not seem to be doing anyone good Tech or coworkers.

PS Mssdoc: all the best to you with this situation.

[rattusdomesticus]

A better remedy all around is a lateral move...

Just a note -- this is how a number of state universities I've worked for ended up with craaaazzzy secretaries. When their insanity is revealed, the d.c. or dean just tries to saddle some other department with the problem person. So the person bounces from department to department, collecting resentments as he/she goes, moving closer and closer to actually acting on his/her threats.

So, yeah, it's one solution. And it makes it not your problem (or your department's problem), but in effect it will someday be someone's problem. Of course, if you're lucky, crazy-tech may end up in someone's department in which there is a dean with a spine. So I guess it's one sort of solution.