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[gypsy_98]

I have a tt position at a R1 university. Last year, my spouse was offered a very lucrative tt position in another part of the country and we decided to move to that part of the country. Commuting was not an option for me because we have small children, so I took a leave of absence for one year. I applied for tt positions at the new location but was not successful in my job search. I did find a job in a non-academic setting that pays more than my tt position. However, I dislike the 9-5 routine, the hierarchical structure, and the politics within the organization. In this organization, having a PhD is quite meaningless because one does not do any actual research or evaluation- you are supposed to manage the research or evaluation being done by independent consultants. Since I will not be able to do any research and publish, my primary concern is that I will not be eligible for tt positions in the future.  I have been in this position for almost 6 months and am very depressed. I feel that as long as I will continue in this organization, my salary and benefits would be great, but what will happen when I will decide to leave? Moreover, I have no autonomy and freedom to do my work.

I am now considering going back to my tt position even though it would mean living alone with my kids and living apart from my spouse. I often wonder whether it was worthwhile to get a PhD. I think having a PhD has really limited my options. Has anyone tried living alone with kids while in a tt position?

[outlier]

Gypsy, I feel for you. I did the tt thing as a single parent, but it wasn't at an R1. The difficulty for me in that situation was that I felt pulled between career and family, and that waffling was entirely too visible to my college, while my husband was clear that career came first for him.

I notice that you say that you (singular) are considering going back to your former position. Where's your husband in all this? I'm assuming it's husband, not wife, because it's usually, though not always, the woman who assumes the major parenting responsibility.

Is your marriage important enough for you to make this decision together? If not, then yeah, do what's best for your career. With good child care you can do it. I think the first thing is to be clear about what your interests are, and the second is that if your interest is in preserving both marriage and career and you decide to go back to your old position, you figure out how to make the long distance marriage a temporary condition. Good luck.

[gypsy_98]

Outlier,
How did you handle this situation? Did you finally manage to find a position that allowed you to live with your husband?

Gypsy

[outlier]

Oh, you don't want to replicate my experience, believe me!

No, we're divorced but now live in the same town, where I've been looking for decent jobs reasonably related to my field for years. AND I just turned down two job offers because it would take me too far from my daughter, who'd stay here for now. My situation's still difficult, 6 years post-divorce.

That's at the heart of my advice to decide if you have a strong enough marriage to survive a move. I'm just saying, make sure you know where you stand, and if you can't have it all, be very clear about which you want more--marriage or career. And if you can't make the decision together so that you're both at peace with it, that's important information.

I don't know how helpful this is. In part, I went ahead and posted it because once you have some advice, however good or bad, others will start to chime in and then you can decide what rings true for you. I wish you the best whatever you decide. I hope you and your spouse can decide together and come to a satisfactory decision.

[dr_crankypants]

This is a really personal question, and I can't tell you what to do.  I do know people at R1s who raise their children mostly alone.  They make it a priority to find good childcare, and other assistance (they hire someone to clean the house, for example).  It is certainly possible to do it.  But a crucial issue is how long you plan to do it for.  Is this a temporary move, until you can find a more permanent solution?  Many of the academic couples I know did that for a few years, and then found other employment.  (Some undoubtedly did not; I'm more likely to know the people who did.)

What are your options?  Does your university have a department that your spouse could get hired in, even at less pay?  Since you mentioned his/her job is lucrative, I'm guessing that it's in a higher demand field.  Is s/he employable at your university?  Can you both look for jobs in a third place, where you might be able to get employed together?
Good luck, and my sympathies are with you!

[zharkov]

I worked in industry before academia, and you have described the downside to a T.   Some things I and others like me did were finding hands-on people who could be co-authors, doing papers or presentations about managing research, and getting the powers that be to let you do some of your own stuff on the side.

Good Luck!

[drsyn]

I get so discouraged when I read posts like this.

I once read a quote that genius in women was wasted.

Please don't try so hard to prove him right.

[smurfette]

I have a tt position at a R1 university. Last year, my spouse was offered a very lucrative tt position in another part of the country and we decided to move to that part of the country.

Gypsy, I'm a little confused... You guys moved just because the spouse's new tt position was more lucrative? I'm not saying that earning more doesn't matter but it seems like a strange trade-off, given that you've pretty much sacrificed your career for this move. Was spouse unemployed before the move?  Can he try for a tt position near your old job?

[malvolio]

That's a tough one. How old are the kids? Can they stay where they are, with your spouse? Is he/she willing to let them go back cross country?

If you are that miserable, go back to your job and academia. See what happens after that. Any chance your spouse could look for another job just as you did (maybe with better results)?

[spork]

I have a tt position at a R1 university. Last year, my spouse was offered a very lucrative tt position in another part of the country and we decided to move to that part of the country.

Gypsy, I'm a little confused... You guys moved just because the spouse's new tt position was more lucrative? I'm not saying that earning more doesn't matter but it seems like a strange trade-off, given that you've pretty much sacrificed your career for this move. Was spouse unemployed before the move?  Can he try for a tt position near your old job?

It sounds as if you expected corporate employment to be as satisfying as academic employment, and you've discovered that for you that's not the case.  You have to decide how to order the priorities of career, marriage, and parenting.  Money plays a role in all of these areas. 

Here are some threads that may provide fodder for thought:

http://chronicle.com/forums/index.php/topic,40274.0.html

http://chronicle.com/forums/index.php/topic,39800.0.html

http://chronicle.com/forums/index.php/topic,37514.0.html

http://chronicle.com/forums/index.php/topic,38607.0.html

http://chronicle.com/forums/index.php/topic,38822.0.html

These threads popped up on a random search; I'm sure there are plenty more.

[sarahanne]

Gypsy,

Why is everyone tip toe-ing around the real problem?

Children deserve an intact two parent family. Parents should do everything within their power to keep a marriage together. Your unhappiness over your current job situation is not a justifiable reason for having a divided home.

If the marriage is NOT working out, that's an entirely new story.

To answer your question. Some academic marriages do survive a long distance marriage. Some do not. Why do you want to take that chance?

Alright guys go ahead and flame me. But I firmly believe that parents must make sacrifices for their children. Gypsy, everyday many parents turn down jobs and/or promotions because of family reasons.

[slac_vap]

I often wonder whether it was worthwhile to get a PhD. I think having a PhD has really limited my options.

Did you enjoy the process of earning the PhD?  Did you enjoy your first years of work on the tenure-track?  If so, then it was worthwhile to get a PhD.  I think that if the PhD gave you joy at the time it was earned, then it was worthwhile.  Even if you now move to a different career, the time you spent pursuing your subject matter was worthwhile.  It helped to shape who you are.  It added interest and richness to your life.  It is not productive to nurse regrets about the things you have done in your life that helped shape who you are.  Work through these thoughts.

As another poster mentioned, this is an intensely personal decision.  You have been mildly chastized already by another poster for making the decision to move with your spouse this year, but I think that was unfair.  We don't know the circumstances involved in that move, so it is not for us to judge.  What we can do is help you clarify your choices, but ultimately it's up to you and your spouse.

Some things to consider:
-Is your university willing to extend your leave of absence another year?  If so, how might that affect your tenure bid later on?
-Can you do any writing while working your 9 to 5?  (See Zharkov's excellent advice, above.)
-Can you pick up a course somewhere as an adjunct, especially if teaching is important to you or your tenure committee?
-Do you have extended family either in your university's area or the area in which you are currently staying?  Is that important to you?  Are they helpful?
-Can you afford living apart from your husband?  If you live apart, how will your quality of life be affected?
-Is it possible for your spouse to find a 9 to 5 in your university's town?
-If you are thinking that your PhD wasn't all it was cracked up to be, is there something else you would consider pursuing?  An MBA, an MD, a DDS, a culinary degree, whatever?  A woman's (or man's) intelligence is not wasted just because they channel their smarts somewhere else.

There are a ton of things to consider here.  I can't tell you what to do.  I know that I couldn't live apart from my kids, and I know that my husband couldn't either, so we wouldn't be able to do what you are proposing.  Even if my husband and I divorced, we still would live near each other.  Even if that meant we both had to work at McDonalds.  But that's my reality, and it might not be yours.

Good luck!
 

[larryc]

Gypsy as a parent you are no longer the most important person in your own life. Your children are. Their concerns, their happiness, and their healthy development is what matters here.  You should not be moving away from them, or taking them from the other parent. You guys stay together.

That is not to say there are not any options here:

1) Since your spouse's new job pays so well, can you just quit and be a stay at home parent for a while? You could adjunct at a local university on the side to get your foot in the door. You are in the sciences I take it, could you strike a deal with a local university that they will take you on if you bring in a grant that would pay your salary or some part of it?

2) Does your spouse know how unhappy you are? Could you all move back to your R1 and your spouse could stay at home or look for work there?

3) You both make a commitment to pursue jobs together in any part of the country. You both go on the market but make it clear that only jobs that include a spousal hire will be considered. This would never work in my field (history) but in some of the sciences it might.

Good luck.

[spork]

Why is everyone tip toe-ing around the real problem?

Me, tip-toeing?  Nah, just trying to say what you and LarryC said better than I did.

[tenured_feminist]

I adore my kids and have sacrificed tremendously for them. But I do try to keep in mind that I will be actively and intensively raising them for about 18 years out of my life. My career, on the other hand, could and should consume something like 35 years or possibly more.

As much as I love my kids, I don't expect those happy memories of coming home early and baking cakes for them to support me after I retire, nor do I want them to have to worry about supporting me after I retire. I hope that my partner and I will stay together until then, but it's an uncertain world and lots of things can happen.

That's why it's called balancing work and family ideally. You and hubby need to have a very frank conversation about how to manage without trashing someone's career.