next »

[spork]

Gennimom,

              True, that is a difference that you point out between now and then. And you are right. You are just as dead if you are killed by a group as by an individual. Horrible, either way. With today's technology, two simple automatic handguns are enough to cause a massacre. No mounted squad on horseback, each with a rifle, is needed. What I expected to hear was that he had a machine gun. But in terms of technology, the Virginia Tech killer did this in a rather low tech way. Making it all that more chilling, for aiming and firing a pistol is more personal than just swiping a whole classroom with a machine gun. 

He did not have an automatic handgun.  He did not have a "machine" gun.  Sheesh. Let's try to be correct in our usage of terms.

One of which, if reports are correct, was a 9mm Glock, a fairly standard semiautomatic handgun.

[grasshopper]

Gennimom,

              True, that is a difference that you point out between now and then. And you are right. You are just as dead if you are killed by a group as by an individual. Horrible, either way. With today's technology, two simple automatic handguns are enough to cause a massacre. No mounted squad on horseback, each with a rifle, is needed. What I expected to hear was that he had a machine gun. But in terms of technology, the Virginia Tech killer did this in a rather low tech way. Making it all that more chilling, for aiming and firing a pistol is more personal than just swiping a whole classroom with a machine gun. 

He did not have an automatic handgun.  He did not have a "machine" gun.  Sheesh. Let's try to be correct in our usage of terms.

Let's also try to be correct in our reading.

Call Me wrote that s/he had expected to hear that the shooter had used a machine gun, not that he actually did. What Call Me actually wrote was that the shooter had a pistol.

[onomatopoeia]

Did anyone see this yet?

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/V/VIRGINIA_TECH_SHOOTING?SITE=VAROA&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2007-04-16-11-02-48

Several things are of interest:

1. The shooter was an English major (so forget about the "serious Asian science/engineering student" stereotype).
2. Several of his creative writing pieces caught a prof's eye for their disturbing content, prompting a referral to campus counseling [this brings us back to one of spork's earlier comments]
3. The Chair of the English Dept has (rightly, in my view) refused to release these writings or his grades to the press.

[grasshopper]

When New Orleans was flooded and destroyed, a friend of mine caught the BBC news (the CBC was on strike at the time, and the CBC news was replaced by the BBC). Anyway, the New Orleans tragedy was buried under a bunch of other stories. It was given about as much air time as an earthquake in India would be given here. It wasn't in their backyards, and it was just another natural disaster that had happened "somewhere else."

Sorry to have to say this on this thread, but this is a crock as far as the US is represented in the UK. NO was big news for a long time in the UK, with a lot of reporting and documentaries.

Well, I don't know what to tell you. Crock or no, when I was watching the BBC news every night, I saw very little coverage of the New Orleans flooding.

[bibliothecula]

Did anyone see this yet?

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/V/VIRGINIA_TECH_SHOOTING?SITE=VAROA&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2007-04-16-11-02-48

Several things are of interest:

1. The shooter was an English major (so forget about the "serious Asian science/engineering student" stereotype).
2. Several of his creative writing pieces caught a prof's eye for their disturbing content, prompting a referral to campus counseling [this brings us back to one of spork's earlier comments]
3. The Chair of the English Dept has (rightly, in my view) refused to release these writings or his grades to the press.

Thanks, onomatopoeia. From this it looks like the faculty was doing the right things to help: paying attention to what the student was writing, referring him to the counseling center, etc.

Who knows how many students have decided not to do something like this because a concerned instructor sent them to the counseling center and they got help?

[bioclem]

Wow, onomatopoeia, I had not heard that.  It is interesting that someone on campus had noticed him, and referred him to counseling.  This is something I've been thinking a lot about since yesterday...  Namely - is there anything I/we can do to help avoid tragedies such as this, such as better recognize troubled students and refer them to the proper places to get help/assistance.  I've certainly referred students to safe places to get help in the past, but have I missed anything that I should have noticed?   

As I was thinking about this yesterday, I wondered if the student had been noticed by faculty members, and if that would have made a difference.  It is interesting to hear that he actually WAS referred to counseling.  I guess all we can do is try our best to be sensitive/alert to these issues, but it seems that sometimes there's no avoiding tragedy.

[spork]

My point in the classroom thread is that "referral to campus counseling center" is often a panacea -- a way for universities cover their bases and not do anything truly substantive.

[draco]

The convocation was a good start at healing.

Giovanni's closing remarks were great: 

"Let's go Hokies!"

[case_insensitive]

Gennimom,

              True, that is a difference that you point out between now and then. And you are right. You are just as dead if you are killed by a group as by an individual. Horrible, either way. With today's technology, two simple automatic handguns are enough to cause a massacre. No mounted squad on horseback, each with a rifle, is needed. What I expected to hear was that he had a machine gun. But in terms of technology, the Virginia Tech killer did this in a rather low tech way. Making it all that more chilling, for aiming and firing a pistol is more personal than just swiping a whole classroom with a machine gun. 

He did not have an automatic handgun.  He did not have a "machine" gun.  Sheesh. Let's try to be correct in our usage of terms.

Let's also try to be correct in our reading.

Call Me wrote that s/he had expected to hear that the shooter had used a machine gun, not that he actually did. What Call Me actually wrote was that the shooter had a pistol.

The shooter apparently had two semi-automatic handguns (some sort of .22 and a 9mm Glock).

CallMe also said, "With today's technology, two simple automatic handguns are enough to cause a massacre. "

And clearly an automatic handgun isn't simple, or available to 99.9999999999% of Americans.  Semi-automatic and automatic are very different things.  That is my point. The media and some posters don't seem to understand the difference.

My point in the classroom thread is that "referral to campus counseling center" is often a panacea -- a way for universities cover their bases and not do anything truly substantive.

I agree. And referring is problematic sometimes as students either don't want to go or they are offended you've referred them.  That is not to say I don't advocate referring, but it's not as simple as it might seem sometimes.

[gennimom]

I have the feeling the shooter had no intention of surviving his actions. Someone who is intent on dying while killing others is a very hard person to stop. They don't care. Somehow that really just ties in with the silent, calm way he went about his business, for me.

The fact that he was carrying handguns just makes it even worse, because the accuracy of such weapons is greater the closer you get to the target.

Okay, let me stop now, before I really depress myself.

[j_source]

It's been months since I've posted on here. I came to this forum to read the thoughts of academics, but I should have expected that hatred and anger toward GWB would be front and center in the discussion. Is it possible for you to set that aside?

There's some psychological reason so many of you want to blame GWB for any and all ills in our country. What are you going to do and who are you going to blame when he's no longer in office and tragedies such as these continue? He wasn't in office when Columbine happened.

Get a grip and let go of the tape loop.  While Bush is an idiot and the worst president we've had in 150 years, he's not responsible for this.  His comment about the right to bear arms in this context was, however,  extraordinarily ill conceived and distasteful.  I'm sure the families of the dead were relieved and comforted to know that the Second Amendment is alive and well.

[bio_prof_]

I'm sure the families of the dead were relieved and comforted to know that the Second Amendment is alive and well.

This is so sadly true, I think I'm going to cry.

[old_school]

I'm sure the families of the dead were relieved and comforted to know that the Second Amendment is alive and well.

This is so sadly true, I think I'm going to cry.

I think that j_source's comment was meant sarcastically, no?

[old_school]

While Bush is an idiot and the worst president we've had in 150 years, he's not responsible for this.  His comment about the right to bear arms in this context was, however,  extraordinarily ill conceived and distasteful. 

well said.

[bio_prof_]

Yes, I get the sarcasm. I guess I'm saying the sarcasm gets so directly to the point that I want to cry. The whole sitaution is messing me up today. I'm coming out of the bathroom and looking both ways to amke sure there isn't someone with a gun. And I love my students. We're actually having a great time finishing out htis semester.