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cactus
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« Reply #15 on: April 10, 2007, 12:29:33 AM » |
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Does anyone remember the "experiment" that some magazine did ages ago . . . I think it was the now-defunct Sassy . . . with Sting? They had Sting pretend to be a busker in the London tube. He made about 5 pounds or something. But the highlight of the write-up was that one Spanish tourist recognized him. He played "Everybreath You Take" for her and she started to cry.
I remember reading this back in the 90s. Does anyone else remember this?
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expmu
New member

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« Reply #16 on: April 10, 2007, 07:13:54 AM » |
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This probably also speaks to the disconnect that happens you take concert music or other art intended for a specific context, and try to make it "public space" art. Visual artist Robert Irwin's work really integrates into public spaces in a sort of "organic" (subtle?) manner (and its designed to do so) whereas the Bell performance is more driven by oppositions (concert music/musician playing in a noisy subway station). With Irwin's art and other installation art, there's an expectation that not all observers will engage with the work in an overt way, but might be affected by it on a more subconscious level. Perhaps Bell's performance did have this effect on commuters.
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qrypt
Qryptacular & not really a Member-Moderator
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the great vampire squid round the face of humanity
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« Reply #17 on: April 10, 2007, 07:38:14 AM » |
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There's some sloppy economic thinking that goes into this article. If I had been there and seen him play, and if I had recognized him (or discerned that he was actually a professional musician), I think I would have been inclined to give him nothing - under the assumption that he earns far more than I do and is probably doing it more for kicks than for the money. There's a balance that many people strike regarding buskers and how much to give: if they suck, give nothing; if they're reasonably talented but look hard up, give something out of a mixture of admiration and compassion/charity; if they're really good, give more purely out of admiration. Bell falls on a further extreme on that continuum, and there's no reason to think the curve is linear.
I'm not suggesting that he got only $32 because people did in fact recognize him. But there's an assumption there that there should be a tight relationship between talent and take, and I doubt that relationship exists.
I think the issue of framing is on track. But I'm still surprised that more people weren't driven by the sheer power of the performance to overcome the framing issue - and at least stop to listen, if not to throw some coins. Most people just don't know what they're listening to.
I'm also struck by the fact that these were mostly government employees. Weber/iron cage, anyone?
Fascinating article...
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"I'm tired of being your love slave!"
"Does that mean I'm not going to get my coffee?"
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tenured_feminist
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« Reply #18 on: April 10, 2007, 09:00:38 AM » |
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The thing that resonated with me was the kids. If I were in a hurry, I might only have paused. But I'd have needed to exercise some real coercion to get my kids not to stop and listen. They've insisted on hanging around and listening for several minutes to classical violin pieces played by a lot less competent people. Back in our old town, which had a small but vibrant street musician culture, some of the street musicians recognized our gang because they always wanted to hang around and listen.
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You people are not fooling me. I know exactly what occurred in that thread, and I know exactly what you all are doing.
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vandoesborgh
Not a Northerner, Not a Southerner: a Western
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« Reply #19 on: April 10, 2007, 09:14:55 AM » |
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I think this article speaks about one thing: the invisible members of our society. How many people stop and look at buskers in the eye, let alone listen? How many people will shake the hand of or stop to talk to someone begging on the street? To most of the passersby Joshua Bell was another anonymous person on the side of the stream begging for their money. I have to admit that I've rarely seen this kind of behavior for buskers in Europe. There is almost always a small group of people standing and listening. Why is that?
I think my response would have been so much different because I'm a musician and I always stop when I hear musicians playing. If I had been there that day, I would have been late to whatever "important" thing I needed to do. But then again, I'm the kind of person who will stay in my car listening to a piece of music until it ends even when I'm already late. :)
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According to this forum, I'm from an undesirable state.
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bio_prof_
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« Reply #20 on: April 10, 2007, 09:32:42 AM » |
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Many times I have had to pass a musician or beautiful piece of art because I had to be somewhere at a particular time. In no way does it mean I did not appreciate the art. It means I did not have that moment to spare for it.
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That's all for now.
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john_proctor
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« Reply #21 on: April 10, 2007, 11:22:56 AM » |
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Just a thought (as someone who will often stop and listen):
It may also indicate that some "street musicians" are a hellova lot better than people give them credit for being. In other words, there was no "wow, this guy is so beyond what I would ordinarily hear" response, either (along with the busy traffic, etc. responses)
I used to love the free music played (routinely) in Memphis and Nashville and New York.
I've heard more than a few street musicians that were no-contest-better than some popular recording or "performing" artists.
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"Look upon me! I'll show you the 'life of the mind.'"
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stapler
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« Reply #22 on: April 10, 2007, 11:35:37 AM » |
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Many times I have had to pass a musician or beautiful piece of art because I had to be somewhere at a particular time. In no way does it mean I did not appreciate the art. It means I did not have that moment to spare for it.
It may also indicate that some "street musicians" are a hellova lot better than people give them credit for being. In other words, there was no "wow, this guy is so beyond what I would ordinarily hear" response, either (along with the busy traffic, etc. responses)
Yes! The whole experiment was conducted: 1) at precisely the time of day when people tend to have the least flexibility in their schedules (morning rush hour) 2) in an environment (downtown DC metro station) that is routinely bathed in the sounds of talented musicians 3) in an environment that really is not at all performance-friendly (right by the doors of a busy subway station whose accoustics are worse than the article states - even simple audio announcements in these stations are comically unintelligible). Had Bell set up in the open air just outside L'Enfant on a Friday afternoon, I believe the results might have been quite different.
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TT Prof in the sciences at an RU/H
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spork
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« Reply #23 on: April 10, 2007, 11:48:41 AM » |
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There should be musicians in airports, where people have to wait for hours. Of course they'd have to compete with "unattended luggage will be removed and destroyed" being broadcast over the PA system every 3 minutes.
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a.k.a. gum-chewing monkey in a Tufts University jacket
"Please do not force people who are exhausted to take medication for hallucinations." -- Memo from the Chair, Department of White Privilege Studies, Fiork University
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« Reply #24 on: April 10, 2007, 01:19:41 PM » |
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There should be musicians in airports, where people have to wait for hours. Of course they'd have to compete with "unattended luggage will be removed and destroyed" being broadcast over the PA system every 3 minutes.
Well, airports are so serious these days. Ever try to fly through LAX?
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voxprincipalis
Foxaliciously Cinnamon-Scented (and Most Poetic)
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« Reply #25 on: April 10, 2007, 03:08:30 PM » |
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There should be musicians in airports, where people have to wait for hours. Of course they'd have to compete with "unattended luggage will be removed and destroyed" being broadcast over the PA system every 3 minutes.
Well, airports are so serious these days. Ever try to fly through LAX? We also have a hard time getting through security, given that we have weird pointy-looking things and strange machines and incomprehensible pieces of equipment that we insist on taking on the plane with us. Airports are not particularly musician-friendly these days. VP
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zarathustra
Because the Chron says I'm a
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« Reply #26 on: April 10, 2007, 05:33:02 PM » |
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There should be musicians in airports, where people have to wait for hours. Of course they'd have to compete with "unattended luggage will be removed and destroyed" being broadcast over the PA system every 3 minutes.
Well, airports are so serious these days. Ever try to fly through LAX? We also have a hard time getting through security, given that we have weird pointy-looking things and strange machines and incomprehensible pieces of equipment that we insist on taking on the plane with us. Airports are not particularly musician-friendly these days. VP Charlotte, NC's airport has live music sometimes. And open pianos for anyone to sit down and play at (I guess). I dunno if want to be reminded everywhere I go of the need to practice. Just me. ;)
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"...undigested hummus trading real estate for this fire dance.." ~C.S.
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copper
Ice Road Truckin'
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« Reply #27 on: April 10, 2007, 08:32:57 PM » |
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There should be musicians in airports, where people have to wait for hours. Of course they'd have to compete with "unattended luggage will be removed and destroyed" being broadcast over the PA system every 3 minutes.
YES! Music soothes the savage beast. And the angry traveller. Today I discovered that the coffeehouse in our student center has an open piano. In two years of going there, I never heard anyone play it. Today someone was playing jazz on it. I didn't stop to listen, beyond standing in line for my bagel. And yesterday morning, when I read about the Joshua Bell experiment, I was unsettled, imagining I had lost an opportunity to hear him play.
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"The most exciting things in life require more courage than we currently have." -- Jack McPhee, or whoever wrote the 4th season of Dawson's.
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sibyl
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« Reply #28 on: April 12, 2007, 05:18:08 PM » |
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Many times I have had to pass a musician or beautiful piece of art because I had to be somewhere at a particular time. In no way does it mean I did not appreciate the art. It means I did not have that moment to spare for it.
It may also indicate that some "street musicians" are a hellova lot better than people give them credit for being. In other words, there was no "wow, this guy is so beyond what I would ordinarily hear" response, either (along with the busy traffic, etc. responses)
Yes! The whole experiment was conducted: 1) at precisely the time of day when people tend to have the least flexibility in their schedules (morning rush hour) 2) in an environment (downtown DC metro station) that is routinely bathed in the sounds of talented musicians 3) in an environment that really is not at all performance-friendly (right by the doors of a busy subway station whose accoustics are worse than the article states - even simple audio announcements in these stations are comically unintelligible). Had Bell set up in the open air just outside L'Enfant on a Friday afternoon, I believe the results might have been quite different. Further tainting the experiment are these factors: 1. Playing music is prohibited in the Metro system. People are unaccustomed to it. 2. Unemployed violinists aren't unemployed because they're untalented; they're unemployed because there are only 168 jobs for them in symphonies. (Sorta like in academia.) Yes, Joshua Bell is the best, but it can be hard to tell -- especially when you put him in an echoey acoustical environment, and you only listen to him for eight measures. 3. The logic behind the conclusion is specious: if these people don't appreciate this particular moment of beauty, then all people are too dead to sensation to appreciate any moments of beauty. The logical fallacies are patent. I took away an entirely different feeling from the article. I was delighted that enough people were touched by his music to toss $40 in his case. Restores my faith in humanity.
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"I do not pretend to set people right, but I do see that they are often wrong." -- Jane Austen, Mansfield Park
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anxiousdee1
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« Reply #29 on: April 12, 2007, 09:02:24 PM » |
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It was morning rush hour. He'd have done a lot better in the evening. People can't be late for work even for Joshua Bell--never heard of him either.
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