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[smurfette]

I know soon I’m going to develop a reputation for getting myself involved in convoluted scenarios, but please bear with me! 

I recently got an offer from a school that I liked a lot (school X).  I'm sick of the job search, am not particularly greedy or picky, and so believe me--if I were single, I would likely accept the offer and be done with this whole thing. Unfortunately, the job prospects for my spouse around the area are not great, and we’d be facing the possibility of living 6 driving hours (or a very inconvenient plane ride) apart for at least 5 years. In the meantime, I have an interview with school Y, which I am equally interested in and is in a much better location for my spouse (we’d still have to live apart, but much closer).  School Y is interviewing only 2 candidates, so I have a 50% chance. I told school Y about the time crunch I am in with school X and they were able to move my interview up, which I really appreciate. School X also knows I have this other interview. However, although I will be able to see school Y with my own eyes before school X’s deadline, school Y told me that they won’t be interviewing their second candidate until later and won’t be making a decision until the end of the month.

So what I’m thinking is this:
Option 1: If I don’t like school Y during the interview I will immediately accept school X’s offer upon my return
Option 2: If I really like school Y and think my chances are good, I will take a gamble and decline X’s offer (and I know that “if my chances are good” is very vague). 

But what I am wondering is whether there is any chance that school Y can reach a decision sooner than they said. I don’t have much experience with this, but is it possible (or ethical?) that if a school likes a candidate a lot and knows they might soon lose the candidate to another school, they'd give some strong indication of an impending offer almost immediately (like the next day) even before interviewing the other people? Of course, I am not planning to ask them to do this, only wondering if it is something they might initiate.   

A few more things…
If I do go with option 2, is it appropriate for me to say “I‘m very impressed with your dept, and have turned down X’s offer”? That way they’d know I am really serious about them.  But they also may find me desperate, which of course at that point I’ll kind of be.
Or, before then, would it be appropriate for me to ask them, maybe a few days after the interview: “I’m very impressed with your program after my visit but need to give an answer to school X in 3 days. Is there anything you can tell me at this point that might help my decision?” 

I’m trying to be fair to everyone and not do anything unprofessional or unethical, so any suggestions are appreciated. Thanks.

[manicpanic]

Could you possibly bargain for more time with School X? Say you have various things to sort out personally before deciding for sure. Meanwhile, try to hurry along Y if possible. I'd get one of the jobs if I were you, unless you have a good temp position currently where you're relatively happy and would'nt mind, worst case scenario, doing a job search next year.

[cactus]

Try to get more time from school X.  People do it all the time.  Say something along the lines of what Manicpanic suggested.

The sad thing about the situation you are in is that if you go with option 2 you might end up with nothing.  Are you and your partner willing for you to have nothing?

If school Y is bringing 2 people to visit and you are first then how you feel about the visit means nothing.  You might make a home run, but the second interviewee might just hit it out of the ball park.  You never know.  The fact that school Y says that they can't make a decision  until the end of the month means that they are as serious about candidate 2 as they are about you.  They clearly want to see you both before they commit to either.  Makes sense, of course.  If you had the upper hand, I think they would have said something like "we'll see what we can do, but can't make any promises."

Also, you should keep in mind that no offer is final until it is in writing and signed by the higher ups.  If at all possible, you should not decline any offer until you actually have another one made on paper.  (This might be impossible though.)

[smurfette]

Thanks already! Just to clarify-- I did explain the situation to X and did bargain for more time. They are being cool about it (giving me several weeks). I don't think I can push for more time...

If I ended up with no job this year, that would be bad. I had already decided to relocate to another part of the country next fall, and decided to end my postdoc because of that. My husband is only looking for jobs on that coast, we are selling the house, it's a done deal.  I could of course adjunct for a year, but I would be upset that with all these possibilities this year I ended up with nothing. Then again, living so far from my husband, for so long, isn't fun either. Sigh.

[sibyl]

First of all, Smurfette, none of the options you've discussed are unprofessional or unethical.

I think this basically boils down to the question of whether the bird in the hand (School X) is worth the two in the bush (School Y and being closer to hubby). 

On the one hand, you are a good candidate; you've already gotten two good offers and you are likely to get more if you stay on the market.  On the other hand, you can't know whether those jobs would be any better than School X; it might be a grim situation two hours from hubby, or a fantastic situation ten hours from hubby.

I'm sidestepping the questions of how this decision would affect your relationship with your husband, who is likely to resent whom, etc., though obviously you need to work this out.  I've said this before: in a two-career couple, especially when one of those careers is in academia, one career is the engine and the other is the caboose, and it's essential that there be agreement about this fact.  The question then becomes whether turning down School X is good for the engine.  Six-hour separations are bad for, but not always fatal to, strong relationships.  Dealing with problems together, openly and honestly, and fighting for shared goals usually strengthens relationships.

It may be different in the sciences, but because I'm in the humanities, if you were my student I'd tell you not to follow option 2 no matter how much you like School Y.  It's one thing to negotiate an offer when two schools are competing for you; it's another thing entirely to give up a good offer when you don't know for sure that another one is coming.  Suppose you followed Option 2 and then School Y did not offer you the job.  What would you do?  Adjunct near your hubby?  What are the prospects for that?  What would that do to your finances and your quality of life?  What would it do for your marketability the next time around -- that is, is it easier to find a job near your husband if you have a TT job at X or an adjunct job down the street?  Would it be harder for you to find adjunct work near your husband than for your husband to find a new job near X? 

If you go to Y and you like it, then you should say the "I'm very impressed but need to give X an answer" thing you mentioned.  (You put it very nicely, btw.)  You're right that you've probably used up all of the leverage you have with X, and cactus is right that School Y has its reasons to be serious.  But once they see you, someone will have the chance to fall in love with you and decide that they can't lose you.  Your leverage with Y will be greater after you visit -- and of course you will also know by then whether Y is as good or better than X.

As always, best wishes for making your decisions.

[nailman]

Well, you could try pushing school X for more time, again -- even though you've already done so.

I think the "desperation factor" is important here. If you are really desperate to be done with the job search process and get a job, maybe it is best just to go with school X.

On the other hand, six hours sounds like you'd just see each other on weekends, though. I've done this for a semester (actually in our case it was 7 hours, and we saw each other roughly every other week) and, although it worked, I wouldn't be willing to do it for five years. I personally would be willing to trade another year in limbo for a position where I'd be closer to my spouse -- so if it were me, I'd consider the odds of the spouse finding a job closer than 6 hours, and if those odds are low, I'd decline offer X in favor of "the bird in the bush".

I don't think there's a right answer here, though. If you and your husband are really committed to making X work, you can go with option 1. Otherwise, as the other poster mentioned, there will probably be other offers -- even if not this year (i.e. from Y), next year.

[prytania3]

Smurfette, is that 6 hours one way? That's a lot of mileage for five years. I don't see how that could be good for a marriage...

[smurfette]

Thanks all so much for your thoughtful responses. Yes, 6 hrs each way. Maybe 5 hrs (not that much better). 5-7 years. There is the possibility of being 2-3 hrs away, but it would be an inferior job for husband. I was trying not to give too many variables, but husband has not 100% decided for the 5-6 hr away locations. He could still take the 2-3 hr away locations, but it's his call and I don't want to push it. It's the location of his training so it could in fact make a major, major difference for his career.

Another thing. After school Y I have a few more interviews. So not getting Y would not kill me. But then I may end up taking a job far from husband anyway.

[athena1]

My two cents. . . I don't think living that far apart is a good idea. I wouldn't do it. But, then, my SO's career is pretty portable.

[nailman]

As long as you're both still in the continental U.S., I can't imagine there are too many places you could end up that are MORE than six hours apart, if you consider air travel a possibility. Maybe you should try and focus on places that will be either within a short (>2 hour?) car drive from where he would be, or a short plane ride? i.e. from big cities in the midwest you can get to big cities on either coast with a plane ride of just a few hours (often significantly less than 6 hours, I think). Or to give another example: Sacramento, CA and L.A. are about 6 hours apart by car, but a one hour plane ride.

If you have a goodly number of interviews lined up, surely you can get an offer from somewhere that will be less than six hours of travel time from one of his options?

Again, I did this for a semester. It's rough. If you have an ordinary two day weekend, it feels like you spend practically the whole weekend traveling: Leave at 8 a.m. Saturday, arrive at 2 p.m. Then leave at 2 p.m. Sunday and arrive back at your job at 10 p.m. Sunday. You're with your spouse for just 24 hours in a week, and you're wiped out from spending all the time driving.

[smurfette]

Sajbug- husband's career will be totally portable... once his 5-7 yrs of training are done. I wish we were there already!

I should clarify that the 6 hrs are driving distance.And there is no way I'd spend 12 hrs every weekend driving (not a fan of driving, to add to the situation), so yes, flying would be involved. Some of the schools I'm looking at are far from places he likes BUT they are in urban areas, so as Nailman said, it's 1 hr quick flight. The problem is that school X is far from an airport. It would requireme driving for 1 hr to get to an airport, then take the flight. That may seem like a small price to pay, but imagine doing this for 7 years?! Also (and I don't resent this, it's just fact), I will be the one doing most of the visiting. Given his hours, being on call, and having bizarre days off, it's much easier for me to plan visits.

See, I was trying to not muddy the waters in this thread by avoiding addressing all the important things Sybil mentioned (who will sacrifice for whom, resent whom, etc). Let me just say to keep things simple that both husband and I are very passionate about our work, very supportive of each other's work AND have both made lots of compromises for each other's work. I believe that is one of the things that makes our marriage strong. So we're starting from a good place. 

Of course, there is always the possbility my mom suggested-- take things 1 year at a time. Live apart for a year, see how it goes. If it's unbearable, someone may decided to move after. I can't imagine going through the search again, but there are lots of things that I am doing now that I wouldn't have pictured doing 2-3 years ago...
I'll stop rambling now.

[lucilla]

Smurfette,
Is the pay really good at School X? I've been commuting by plane for over a year now, and even with frequent flyer miles and active time finding cheaper flights, it added up a lot. I'm not saying it wasn't/isn't worth it to keep the relationship in good shape, but it would have helped to be making money hand over fist.

In some situations the salary is not so important. If a long-distance rel. is a factor, having lots of money (and flexibility with teaching hours, too--to leave you time for that airport schlep) can really smooth things out.

Finally, you''ll have to make the best decision you can make at the time, and it sounds as if you have several good-enough (though not perfect) choices. You can't foresee all the factors that will be part of the decision in advance, so even if you make a decision that involves some regrets (few don't!), it can end up being even better than you thought.

I wish you all the best!  Lucilla

[smurfette]

School X is being so nice about this whole thing-- which actually bodes well in their favor. I've been given almost 4 weeks to think.

Thank you all for replying. I'm sick with a cold, stressed out, and trying to get ready for school Y. Husband is away on interviews on his own--ironically, one right near X and one right near Y. Part of me is waiting for the sky to part so that I can be given some definite sign of what to do... But I have some time to think and maybe the visit to Y will be very enlightening.

[bigsky]

If school Y was willing to move up your visit then maybe they will be willng to act before the other interview. We interviewed 2 candidates for a job and they were both were hired as they were both well liked. Who knows? Also, just because you are one of 2 interviewees it doesn't mean you have a 50/50 chance. They could always have a failed search if they can't decide between the 2 or they might bring in another candidate. Not to be pessimistic, just realistic. Good luck.

[smurfette]

The other thread about backing out of signed offers got me thinking. And let me state for the record that in my current situation, backing out of a signed contract is NOT something I am considering. If I sign with school X, I sign with X and that's that.

But there seems to be a lot of ambiguity about whether it's acceptable to get out a verbal offer. I have never considered doing that either (unless, say, the contract arrived and it didn't reflect what had been agreed on verbally and the school started acting all weird and refusing to put things in writing).  I am not saying I'm thinking of doing this, but I am curious as to how many people would accept X's offer verbally on their given deadline and then if a week later Y made an offer, would back out before signing? Is this actually acceptable? Or horrible? Or a grey area?