next »

[Noam]

Hi all,

In a week I'll be receiving my M.A. in poetics at the New College in San Francisco (yay!). I was originally accepted into the M.F.A. program, but decided to pursue the academic degree instead, since I wanted the scholarly experience. I've been supporting myself doing flex-time computer work, with a plan to move into teaching college English or creative writing after amassing some modest publishing credentials.  

Well, computer work is becoming quickly stultifying, and I'm becoming jaded with the dream of publishing, so I'm reassessing. Initially, I thought that with an M.A. in poetics and a list of publications, I could 5-10 years hence prove both my academic and creative credentials. Was I wrong? Should I start building my teaching résumé at community colleges now? My other option is to do another 12 or so credits at New College and get both the M.A. and the M.F.A. However, I'd sooner get the teaching experience than the slip of paper if they'll lead me down similar roads.

Thanks!
Noam

[Anonymous Adjunct]

Dear Noam,

Get the M.F.A. -- most colleges want the terminal degree, even if you're an adjunct. The M.A. won't be a waste, either. If you truly want to teach, then do it, no matter what you have to do -- be an adjunct, take a one-year appointment, etc. If you work outside of academe, teach one or two classes as an adjunct on the side.

I tried the road where I worked on my art CV outside of academe, and 10 years after getting my M.F.A., I'm back at square one as an adjunct. If you truly want the tenure track, then teach, write, publish, and do it now -- first as a graduate teaching assistant, then as an adjunct or other instructor.

Anonymous Adjunct

[Anon]

My husband is an art professor, so I know the M.A./M.F.A. deal well. Get the MFA. It is the Ph.D. of the performing and creative arts. Without it  you are no better off than a sociologist or biologist with an M.A., hoping to teach at a college or university. In other words, with a fat chance in hell!

It is bad enough that most people in academe don't even understand that an M.F.A. is equivalent to a Ph.D., and think it is some sort of master's degree. With an M.A., the only place you can teach is in an inferior college (i.e. a bible college) or a community college. And even community colleges try to hire M.F.A.'s as often as possible.

Only Pulitzer Prize winners get good (or any) teaching jobs without an M.F.A. They are usually lousy teachers, and universities hire them for the publicity and attention they get in the papers and from trustees/alumni. Even a stellar publication record or gallary/show record won't get a creative academic a job.

[Anonymous creative writer]

Actually, the M.F.A. is not equivalent to a Ph.D., at least in English. The M.F.A. has been supplanted as the highest degree by the Ph.D. with creative dissertation. The Ph.D. with creative dissertation  (or Ph.D. in creative writing) usually gives the person broader training in scholarship than the M.F.A. (i.e., more coursework than just workshops, comprehensive qualifying exams) and also takes longer to complete -- four to six years instead of two to three.

In English studies, at least, an M.F.A. needs phenomenal publications in order to be hired because the degree has been devalued by its prevalence (something like 200+ programs offer M.F.A.'s in creative writing), while creative-writing Ph.D. programs number somewhere around two dozen. Graduates of these programs are not only competitive candidates for creative-writing jobs, but also literature generalist jobs, especially at teaching-oriented colleges.

[Anonymous Adjunct]

A Ph.D. is fundamentally different than an M.F.A., and they are seen as equivalent only to the extent that they are both terminal degrees. Specifically, the M.F.A. is in an applied discipline, while a Ph.D. is in an academic discipline.  

Some programs are now offering D.F.A. degrees, especially in theatre arts, and some universities abroad are also offering them in other areas. A Ph.D. with creative dissertation sounds to me like a completely different track, not the new paradigm for creative and applied disciplines.  

Us poor sods in fine arts would have to probably just go out and get both degrees for the same amount of time and effort you describe. With this trend, we won't get out of school until our fifties, even if we go straight through.

To answer Noam's original question: If the jobs in your discipline require an M.F.A., then get the M.F.A. If they require another degree, then get that other degree. Do not get anything less than the minimum degree required. Other posters may have input on whether getting more education than the minimum helps. I have a feeling it doesn't guarantee anything.

Cheers,

Anonymous Adjunct

[Anonymous]

If the M.F.A. is a terminal degree, then definitely pursue it. Having a terminal degree rather than just an M.A. puts you in a different category. Plus, if you decide to teach as an adjunct, many schools pay at a higher rate for those with a terminal degree.

I have a J.D., which is considered a terminal degree. I chose to work in the legal field and teach part-time as an adjunct. I wasn't sure I wanted to teach full time and I earned a nice income.

Since you're finishing the M.A., you could teach while pursuing the M.F.A. -- that is what I would do. You learn so much while you're teaching and you'll be able to put together a great teaching portfolio (which is what I'm working on). Plus you'll enjoy it! Put in the education now because you probably won't do this later. Good luck!

[Anon]

My husband, who is a sculptor/art professor, would be overjoyed if a D.F.A. was offered in art. For studio art, an M.F.A. is still the only terminal degree and art departments know this -- it is everyone else who doesn't seem to know it! He is so sick and tired of dealing with this issue that he could just tear his hair out. While theatre may be offering D.F.A.'s now, studio art certainly doesn't anywhere that he has ever heard of.  He writes scholarly papers and gives conference talks, so he would be a great candidate for such a degree.